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Snow still looking for top 4 d-man; training camp invite turned down

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08-27-2011, 04:20 PM
  #51
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Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
That "finally healthy Rick DiPietro" mention makes me NOT want McCabe but instead a stay at home guy.

Our problems with one dependent clause shifted to defense unless he hurts himself outta the team's way. Thank GOD Hamonic and JoeyMac are looking good and Streit is healthy!

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08-27-2011, 05:35 PM
  #52
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I'd rather have Rolston at the point. His slapshot is soooooo underrated. Even at age, he can just fire the puck from long range at a blazing velocity
From a Rangers fans perspective--late last year when we brought McCabe in. On the pwp he makes nice plays--patient with the puck--capable of drawing defenders out of positon and making a play--at the same time he's not shy at all at putting shots on net and he still has a very hard (as well as very accurate) shot. That's the good part.

The bad part is at even strength. He always was at least somewhat an aggressive physical defender. He doesn't have the speed or the lateral movement to chase at all or play that kind of game anymore. In his own defensive end he stuck close to his own slot just so as not to constantly be caught out. PK'ing he's a nightmare waiting to happen.

If the Isles want someone to help their pwp he'd be a pretty good addition but if they're looking for a top 4 guy--forget it because he won't last very long at that.

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08-27-2011, 06:00 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Caustic Acrostic View Post
I agree with most of this, but I still think pre-season activity will very likely yield an option better than McCabe. I'm not saying that it has to be another dip into the waiver wire and getting fiercely lucky, but either through this or via trade, I think that a better player, stop-gap or otherwise can be had as soon as the Isles' cap space and trade package value become more of a known commodity. Cap compliance and player evaluation should force a little more movement. To coin a certain blogger many of us LOL at, "The Sabres' domino will be the first to fall."

At this point I just want it to be done....I'm tired of flip-flopping from wanting to keep/trade Bailey/Comeau + (insert depth D-man, pick & prospect here) for XXXX XXXXXXX.....
I agree. I don't think we need to jump on McCabe right now. I agree that waiting may be bring better options-but then again it may not. It's only a little over a month before the season starts. If we don't get something done within say the next 2, def. 3 weeks-then I'd say jump on McCabe if available.

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08-27-2011, 06:20 PM
  #54
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I agree with the majority of your post. But people on these boards are overrating the value of our young players. We won't be getting a top-4 from the free agent market (obviously), and quite frankly-we never really had a chance.

How many top-4 defensemen have the Islanders ever acquired from the FA market over the past 10 years? Streit. That's all I can think of. And he had ONE good year, where he played wing for tons of the time. Even Streit was a gamble (granted it's more than paid off).

My point is this: the price for a top-4 D is WAY too high via trade (you see how much Wiz cashed in for?!). You don't think Columbus tried shopping around for other options first? You don't think Snow's been on the phone calling? Of course. We cannot get a proven vet on D who's worthy of playing those kind of minutes, and talent for peanuts.

It's going to cost an arm and a leg. Just Comeau, or just Bailey isn't going to cut it. They don't really hold that much value (especially Bailey).

McCabe would instantly improve our power play. Even if he's taken a few steps back, he'll take some attention off of Streit, and free up from space for him. That alone is critical, considering Streit's been out for a whole season, and to be frank: we don't know how he's going to play this year.
I agree, and normally I wouldn't even consider this route but ever since the rule changes that opened the game up, forwards have risen in value. The old rule of thumb was that lb for lb defensive prospects were worth more than forward prospects. Over the past couple of years I have seen more than a few comments from GMs and scouts saying that's changed, in part because of the game, but also in part because it takes all or most of a defenseman's RFA time frame (up to age 26) to start hitting the bottom of his potential whereas forwards give you a solid taste of what they are or aren't before that time.

We do have some talented forwards. I would put Tavares and Grabner on the do not touch list. Every other player is subject to trade if it brings us their equal on defense who is young, with no exceptions. The reason I peel off Grabner and Tavares is because they have unique attributes that you won't find anywhere else. The rest... do not have that luxury. This trade is that critical to the next step that they have to consider some hard choices.

If I am Snow I am polling teams for what Bailey, Comeau, and our first or second this year, in any combination there of, can land us. I would hope it would just be one of the kids, plus one of the picks.

It needs to be done. Imagine having a car with top end parts but you are lacking a transmission and one won't be available for another 4 years? Someone offers you their transmission from their Pinto for your Ferrari intake valve which you have several of, plus a wheel which you have 6 of. It may be serious downgrading, but at least you can now get where you need to go. That is the quandary the club is in, and is no doubt impacted further by the secret ceiling Garth has been given by Wang.

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08-27-2011, 06:29 PM
  #55
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I think we are ok on defense right now, the problem is that we don't have any depth if one of our top 3 defenseman go down (Streit, Hamonic, Macdonald). I would really like to add one more solid top 4 guy, and one 6/7 defenseman.

I think a package of Comeau and a B level prospect and a mid level pick could get us a good #4, decent number 3 defenseman.

The Islanders should look to a team like the kings, they have a lot of young defenseman and a lot of solid NHL defenseman, and they are weak on the wings. We could certainly get someone from them.

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08-27-2011, 06:35 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by A Pointed Stick View Post
I agree, and normally I wouldn't even consider this route but ever since the rule changes that opened the game up, forwards have risen in value. The old rule of thumb was that lb for lb defensive prospects were worth more than forward prospects. Over the past couple of years I have seen more than a few comments from GMs and scouts saying that's changed, in part because of the game, but also in part because it takes all or most of a defenseman's RFA time frame (up to age 26) to start hitting the bottom of his potential whereas forwards give you a solid taste of what they are or aren't before that time.

We do have some talented forwards. I would put Tavares and Grabner on the do not touch list. Every other player is subject to trade if it brings us their equal on defense who is young, with no exceptions. The reason I peel off Grabner and Tavares is because they have unique attributes that you won't find anywhere else. The rest... do not have that luxury. This trade is that critical to the next step that they have to consider some hard choices.

If I am Snow I am polling teams for what Bailey, Comeau, and our first or second this year, in any combination there of, can land us. I would hope it would just be one of the kids, plus one of the picks.

It needs to be done. Imagine having a car with top end parts but you are lacking a transmission and one won't be available for another 4 years? Someone offers you their transmission from their Pinto for your Ferrari intake valve which you have several of, plus a wheel which you have 6 of. It may be serious downgrading, but at least you can now get where you need to go. That is the quandary the club is in, and is no doubt impacted further by the secret ceiling Garth has been given by Wang.
You would be willing to trade Okposo? The kid has special attributes, he is a leader, great 2 way play, and he has a ton of potential offensively. Anyone who says he won't be more than a 60 point player is wrong IMO. In general power forwards take a long time to develop. the kid has wicked shot, just needs to work a bit on accuracy he is probably the second best playmaker on the team behind JT. The kid has 70+ point potential, I certainly am not willing to trade him.

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08-27-2011, 06:41 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Sammy2010 View Post
Islanders not looking to add veteran forward
By BRETT CYRGALIS


"Right now, I don't have any plans to add another forward to our group," Snow told The Post. "As much as we'd like to add quality veterans, we're not going to box out our young guys."
My hope is this was a nice way to say that they had no intention of hiring Miro. If they really mean it and the best they can do for Tavares is a retirement era Rolston, and more PAP, then I hope both Wang and Snow get gobbled up by a funnel cloud tomorrow and dropped head first into a waste water treatment unit, because this would be that shameful.

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08-27-2011, 06:54 PM
  #58
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You would be willing to trade Okposo? The kid has special attributes, he is a leader, great 2 way play, and he has a ton of potential offensively. Anyone who says he won't be more than a 60 point player is wrong IMO. In general power forwards take a long time to develop. the kid has wicked shot, just needs to work a bit on accuracy he is probably the second best play maker on the team behind JT. The kid has 70+ point potential, I certainly am not willing to trade him.
I'd rather not, but recall I said his equivalent on defense. If they found that, that would be a pretty good defense man, no? If you say he is untrade-able under any conditions, where does one set the bar on who is trade-able? You have to give to get in most trades where Milbury is not one of the GMs.

Or do you think our prospects are the best? If LA offered us Doughty for say Bailey, Okposo, and Comeau I'd drive them all back and forth tomorrow. Oh sacrilege, how dare I suggest such a heinous thing that would cause us to wind up with one of the top three offensive defensemen in the league for the next decade+.


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08-27-2011, 07:27 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by A Pointed Stick View Post
I'd rather not, but recall I said his equivalent on defense. If they found that, that would be a pretty good defense man, no? If you say he is untrade-able under any conditions, where does one set the bar on who is trade-able? You have to give to get in most trades where Milbury is not one of the GMs.

Or do you think our prospects are the best? If LA offered us Doughty for say Bailey, Okposo, and Comeau I'd drive them all back and forth tomorrow. Oh sacrilege, how dare I suggest such a heinous thing that would cause us to wind up with one of the top three offensive defensemen in the league for the next decade+.
Doughty is not and will not become available.

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08-27-2011, 07:53 PM
  #60
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Doughty is not and will not become available.
I agree completely. I am just addressing the concept that certain players on this club are untouchable.

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08-27-2011, 07:59 PM
  #61
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Originally Posted by A Pointed Stick View Post
I'd rather not, but recall I said his equivalent on defense. If they found that, that would be a pretty good defense man, no? If you say he is untrade-able under any conditions, where does one set the bar on who is trade-able? You have to give to get in most trades where Milbury is not one of the GMs.

Or do you think our prospects are the best? If LA offered us Doughty for say Bailey, Okposo, and Comeau I'd drive them all back and forth tomorrow. Oh sacrilege, how dare I suggest such a heinous thing that would cause us to wind up with one of the top three offensive defensemen in the league for the next decade+.
Obviously we aren't getting Doughty for anything short of Tavares going the other way. Right now there is no reason to trade one of our veteran forwards that is still extremely young for anything short of a major overpayment. Okposo is a better player than Grabner, if Okposo is tradable, than Grabner should be tradable as well. Every player realistically is tradable, the great one himself was traded during his prime.

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08-27-2011, 08:34 PM
  #62
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You can't trade Okposo or Grabner after they just signed five year deals but I agree with the general idea of trading one of our better forwards for a good d-man.

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08-27-2011, 08:38 PM
  #63
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I hope Snow sticks to his guns, even if we get nobody, fans around here have no patience

before last year we didnt have Grabner, or Hamonic and Amac was a number 4 and people were saying Parenteau was of no use

the year before they were saying who the hell is this Moulson guy.

The fact is We are coming along quite nicely, I dont care that some people are tired of losing, I want Garth to make solid moves, like he says trades that make sense now and in the future.....

I think of all the people clamoring for stop gap defensemen, giving up Comeau or Bailey for pennies on the Dollar, They are showing their impatience, Bailey especially mirrors the Sedins early in their careers, but no lets trade him

or Comeau a kid with 4 straight years of 10+ point growth, if we had panicked and made moves last year would we have Grabner, would Hamonic or Amac have developed? let Garth do what he's done... if we dont make the playoffs but we show tangible growth as we have Ill be perfectly happy

Milbury and Maloney made enough of these trades for the sake of making a trade to last a lifetime, I say let Garth do what he's done, its working. Wishart was a plus 5 last season in 20 games, Montoya was lights out, seems to me the GM knows what hes doing

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08-27-2011, 08:47 PM
  #64
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Obviously we aren't getting Doughty for anything short of Tavares going the other way. Right now there is no reason to trade one of our veteran forwards that is still extremely young for anything short of a major overpayment. Okposo is a better player than Grabner, if Okposo is tradable, than Grabner should be tradable as well. Every player realistically is tradable, the great one himself was traded during his prime.
In a backwards way, I see Okposo as being more trade-ready than Grabner. Any team giving up a d-man of note will want something notable coming back. Okie's attributes make him the likely better player in terms of overall career, but Grabner's speed does more on the scoresheet right now and likely next year, barring a break-out year from KO. End result, the Isles could likely hide what they would lack with KO more successfully plugging Comeau or Niederreiter into his spot and having a better d-man to utilize, than trading Comeau and getting something less sure coming back the other way.

Note: I don't advocate trading Okposo for anything less than a seriously good deal, but I could see Comeau or Niederreiter filling the #2 RW spot with palpable production easier than giving up Comeau & Bailey for another team's unfinished project and losing the secondary scoring necessary to diminish the damage from having an unproven/inexperienced quantity on the blueline come back in trade.

I'd rather shop Comeau & Bailey with a high pick to get 2 players back - a d-man with a fairly high ceiling and a reliable 3rd line stop gap. If Minnesota had any right-shooting d-men of note, I'd look into a package involving Colton Gillies (not because of relation/namesake entirely; he's mean and still rounding out his game. Where better to do that than where your cousin played? )

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08-27-2011, 09:25 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Caustic Acrostic View Post
In a backwards way, I see Okposo as being more trade-ready than Grabner. Any team giving up a d-man of note will want something notable coming back. Okie's attributes make him the likely better player in terms of overall career, but Grabner's speed does more on the scoresheet right now and likely next year, barring a break-out year from KO. End result, the Isles could likely hide what they would lack with KO more successfully plugging Comeau or Niederreiter into his spot and having a better d-man to utilize, than trading Comeau and getting something less sure coming back the other way.

Note: I don't advocate trading Okposo for anything less than a seriously good deal, but I could see Comeau or Niederreiter filling the #2 RW spot with palpable production easier than giving up Comeau & Bailey for another team's unfinished project and losing the secondary scoring necessary to diminish the damage from having an unproven/inexperienced quantity on the blueline come back in trade.

I'd rather shop Comeau & Bailey with a high pick to get 2 players back - a d-man with a fairly high ceiling and a reliable 3rd line stop gap. If Minnesota had any right-shooting d-men of note, I'd look into a package involving Colton Gillies (not because of relation/namesake entirely; he's mean and still rounding out his game. Where better to do that than where your cousin played? )
I agree that Okie would have a lot more value than Grabner right now on the trading block. But is it worth creating a hole to fill another hole? IMO Our first 2 right wingers would be Parenteau and unproven Nino or 3rd line material Comeau.

On defense I see us having more potential top 4 material kiddies than wingers. Right now I think we have 4 3rd line players in Bailey, Rolston, Comeau, and Nino.

If we are really looking to improve this team we should shop Nino (or one of our other top prospects preferably not Strome), I know many of you are going to be against it. But he would bring us back a very good return. Certainly get us a prospect or young player who is starting to establish himself and has a ton of potential like Nino does. This will keep our team intact, while adding a very good defenseman to it.

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08-27-2011, 09:27 PM
  #66
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I hope Snow sticks to his guns, even if we get nobody, fans around here have no patience

before last year we didnt have Grabner, or Hamonic and Amac was a number 4 and people were saying Parenteau was of no use

the year before they were saying who the hell is this Moulson guy.

The fact is We are coming along quite nicely, I dont care that some people are tired of losing, I want Garth to make solid moves, like he says trades that make sense now and in the future.....

I think of all the people clamoring for stop gap defensemen, giving up Comeau or Bailey for pennies on the Dollar, They are showing their impatience, Bailey especially mirrors the Sedins early in their careers, but no lets trade him

or Comeau a kid with 4 straight years of 10+ point growth, if we had panicked and made moves last year would we have Grabner, would Hamonic or Amac have developed? let Garth do what he's done... if we dont make the playoffs but we show tangible growth as we have Ill be perfectly happy

Milbury and Maloney made enough of these trades for the sake of making a trade to last a lifetime, I say let Garth do what he's done, its working. Wishart was a plus 5 last season in 20 games, Montoya was lights out, seems to me the GM knows what hes doing

It is hilarious that some fans throw out the "no patience" claim. This team has not won a playoff round in nearly two decades. Snow has acquired some nice pieces, but all teams have some nice pieces. If they continue to finish out of the playoffs, it adds up to nothing. The team finished further out of the playoffs than the year before. So far what he is doing is not working.

You are OK with NOT making the playoffs again. It is amazing how low the bar is set with this team.

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08-27-2011, 09:40 PM
  #67
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From a Rangers fans perspective--late last year when we brought McCabe in. On the pwp he makes nice plays--patient with the puck--capable of drawing defenders out of positon and making a play--at the same time he's not shy at all at putting shots on net and he still has a very hard (as well as very accurate) shot. That's the good part.

The bad part is at even strength. He always was at least somewhat an aggressive physical defender. He doesn't have the speed or the lateral movement to chase at all or play that kind of game anymore. In his own defensive end he stuck close to his own slot just so as not to constantly be caught out. PK'ing he's a nightmare waiting to happen.

If the Isles want someone to help their pwp he'd be a pretty good addition but if they're looking for a top 4 guy--forget it because he won't last very long at that.
Which is why the only way I take McCabe in is if the Isles get hit with the injury bug and he is the Mike Mottau of last year.

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08-27-2011, 10:00 PM
  #68
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It is hilarious that some fans throw out the "no patience" claim. This team has not won a playoff round in nearly two decades. Snow has acquired some nice pieces, but all teams have some nice pieces. If they continue to finish out of the playoffs, it adds up to nothing. The team finished further out of the playoffs than the year before. So far what he is doing is not working.

You are OK with NOT making the playoffs again. It is amazing how low the bar is set with this team.
First off making the playoffs is not a great accomplishment. There is only 1 winner at the end of the season and 29 losers.

Did the team do worse last season than the season before? Yes it did, but the young kids all took a step forward, we had a ton of injuries, and atrocious goaltending. Our offense greatly improved, and with the addition of Streit it should be even better.

Our forwards are a very good group IMO, now with Reasoner and Rolston our bottom 6 is solid, and our PK should be much improved.

This team might not make the playoffs this year, but I would bet we see a major improvement in this team.

We cut more fat off this team in the offseason (Konopka, Gervais, Hunter) and added some good pieces in Rolston, Reasoner, and you can even include Streit and possibly Nabakov.

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08-27-2011, 10:07 PM
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First off making the playoffs is not a great accomplishment. There is only 1 winner at the end of the season and 29 losers.
I see, the culture of losing is OK for the kids, and knowing the team has no chance at winning the Cup is also OK.

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08-27-2011, 10:58 PM
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It is hilarious that some fans throw out the "no patience" claim. This team has not won a playoff round in nearly two decades. Snow has acquired some nice pieces, but all teams have some nice pieces. If they continue to finish out of the playoffs, it adds up to nothing. The team finished further out of the playoffs than the year before. So far what he is doing is not working.

You are OK with NOT making the playoffs again. It is amazing how low the bar is set with this team.
whats hilarious is, is fans like You who cant see that this rebuild started with the 2008 draft you want to talk 20 years with no playoffs? how is that Snows fault?

this team finally is on the right track yet the idiots who have no patience want to jump right back in the Quicki fix quagmire that Milbury ruined our team with instead of Luongo, Chara, Redden in his prime, McCabe Heatley BerTuzzi and Spezza as the core of our team Milbury listened to the Impatient crowd and sold out for pennies on the dollar

The fools are those who refuse to learn from history but thats okay you want to blame Snow for things well before he got here. Somebody had to tear down the mess that was this team and restock the cupboard, But i suppose youre one who believes we should just refurbish the old barn huh? just like you have to tear down and build a new arena, Garth has done things the right way, not in 20 years, but going on 4

its amazing how some people want to use a rotting carcass and build a team that way, instead of starting fresh, and building a team that will last, you might be happy with that, but im not,

My view is fans like you who have no patience dont deserve a winner, because you lack appreciation. Ive been here since day one
Ive been here for all the bad times, so I know the foolishness of trying to shortcut the process The best thing about Garth Snow is that he doesnt listen to the chicken littles, Thats the thing that gives me the greatest Hope for our future.

so you go ahead and piss and moan about the Last 20 years,I know we had clowns running things for much of that, but im not going to complain about the guy who finally said. Enough with the excuses, I may not have a state of the art building, and my owner may be a nut job and others may not have limits like I do on my payroll, but im going to do whats best for this franchise,

thats Garth Snow, and I say hell yeah he's done a good job, no matter what some whiny "I want it now" chicken little says, if you cant see definite progress in spite of things beyond his control you obviously arent looking very hard. and blaming him for the mess things were before, isnt his problem, no matter how much you try to make them his

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08-27-2011, 11:02 PM
  #71
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whats hilarious is, is fans like You who cant see that this rebuild started with the 2008 draft you want to talk 20 years with no playoffs? how is that Snows fault?

this team finally is on the right track yet the idiots who have no patience want to jump right back in the Quicki fix quagmire that Milbury ruined our team with instead of Luongo, Chara, Redden in his prime, McCabe Heatley BerTuzzi and Spezza as the core of our team Milbury listened to the Impatient crowd and sold out for pennies on the dollar

The fools are those who refuse to learn from history but thats okay you want to blame Snow for things well before he got here. Somebody had to tear down the mess that was this team and restock the cupboard, But i suppose youre one who believes we should just refurbish the old barn huh? just like you have to tear down and build a new arena, Garth has done things the right way, not in 20 years, but going on 4

its amazing how some people want to use a rotting carcass and build a team that way, instead of starting fresh, and building a team that will last, you might be happy with that, but im not,

My view is fans like you who have no patience dont deserve a winner, because you lack appreciation. Ive been here since day one
Ive been here for all the bad times, so I know the foolishness of trying to shortcut the process The best thing about Garth Snow is that he doesnt listen to the chicken littles, Thats the thing that gives me the greatest Hope for our future.

so you go ahead and piss and moan about the Last 20 years,I know we had clowns running things for much of that, but im not going to complain about the guy who finally said. Enough with the excuses, I may not have a state of the art building, and my owner may be a nut job and others may not have limits like I do on my payroll, but im going to do whats best for this franchise,

thats Garth Snow, and I say hell yeah he's done a good job, no matter what some whiny "I want it now" chicken little says, if you cant see definite progress in spite of things beyond his control you obviously arent looking very hard. and blaming him for the mess things were before, isnt his problem, no matter how much you try to make them his
Well ****ing said!

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08-27-2011, 11:19 PM
  #72
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As I ride out Irene () on the south shore of western suffolk, the process of rebuilds from the fan POV (me included) is interesting. Based on the threads popping up around Islander message boards, it's safe to say that the quandary now is whether to invest some of the youth accumulated (to improve the club) or to take the organic approach, staying the track that has led to this current point (marginal development, cusp of taking 'the next step').

With that said, what would the in-between (a balance of both POVs) look like?

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08-27-2011, 11:32 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by mikepelfrey View Post
whats hilarious is, is fans like You who cant see that this rebuild started with the 2008 draft you want to talk 20 years with no playoffs? how is that Snows fault?

this team finally is on the right track yet the idiots who have no patience want to jump right back in the Quicki fix quagmire that Milbury ruined our team with instead of Luongo, Chara, Redden in his prime, McCabe Heatley BerTuzzi and Spezza as the core of our team Milbury listened to the Impatient crowd and sold out for pennies on the dollar

The fools are those who refuse to learn from history but thats okay you want to blame Snow for things well before he got here. Somebody had to tear down the mess that was this team and restock the cupboard, But i suppose youre one who believes we should just refurbish the old barn huh? just like you have to tear down and build a new arena, Garth has done things the right way, not in 20 years, but going on 4

its amazing how some people want to use a rotting carcass and build a team that way, instead of starting fresh, and building a team that will last, you might be happy with that, but im not,

My view is fans like you who have no patience dont deserve a winner, because you lack appreciation. Ive been here since day one
Ive been here for all the bad times, so I know the foolishness of trying to shortcut the process The best thing about Garth Snow is that he doesnt listen to the chicken littles, Thats the thing that gives me the greatest Hope for our future.

so you go ahead and piss and moan about the Last 20 years,I know we had clowns running things for much of that, but im not going to complain about the guy who finally said. Enough with the excuses, I may not have a state of the art building, and my owner may be a nut job and others may not have limits like I do on my payroll, but im going to do whats best for this franchise,

thats Garth Snow, and I say hell yeah he's done a good job, no matter what some whiny "I want it now" chicken little says, if you cant see definite progress in spite of things beyond his control you obviously arent looking very hard. and blaming him for the mess things were before, isnt his problem, no matter how much you try to make them his
Whether the rebuild is successful or not remains to be seen.

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08-28-2011, 12:12 AM
  #74
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Whether the rebuild is successful or not remains to be seen.
let me ask you something honestly, When Snow came in this was a playoff team, though a fractured one, because of the Yashin/Peca divide, We had a prospect cupboard that was basically bereft of talent, first thing Snow did was trade what little we had left for Smyth who was an emotional leader of the highest order. it was Snows hope that Smyth would galvanize the roster, weld the rift and give him time to restock through the Draft.

to me it was all perfectly logical, but unfortunately Smyth took less from the Avs and left. My question, Knowing all this what would you have done? do you try to win with a broken foundation or do you tear it all down? knowing not only must you restock, but you have to gut the place to root out and fumigate any remaining pests?

its a simple question. and I for one know what I would have done. Since then knowing My decision, I just look for discernable Progress.

I see the prospect shelf getting deeper, I see us with a legit top 9, which i cant say we've had in forever, We got a bad break with Rick in goal being injured but based on how good he was when he signed, it was potentially a great deal, and the defense is coming along, We even have actual depth at the bridge...... so yeah knowing what my decision was I can say yeah im ok with where we are

so how would you have answered my question

Knowing all this what would you have done? do you try to win with a broken foundation or do you tear it all down?

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08-28-2011, 01:09 AM
  #75
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Originally Posted by mikepelfrey View Post
whats hilarious is, is fans like You who cant see that this rebuild started with the 2008 draft you want to talk 20 years with no playoffs? how is that Snows fault?

this team finally is on the right track yet the idiots who have no patience want to jump right back in the Quicki fix quagmire that Milbury ruined our team with instead of Luongo, Chara, Redden in his prime, McCabe Heatley BerTuzzi and Spezza as the core of our team Milbury listened to the Impatient crowd and sold out for pennies on the dollar

The fools are those who refuse to learn from history but thats okay you want to blame Snow for things well before he got here. Somebody had to tear down the mess that was this team and restock the cupboard, But i suppose youre one who believes we should just refurbish the old barn huh? just like you have to tear down and build a new arena, Garth has done things the right way, not in 20 years, but going on 4

its amazing how some people want to use a rotting carcass and build a team that way, instead of starting fresh, and building a team that will last, you might be happy with that, but im not,

My view is fans like you who have no patience dont deserve a winner, because you lack appreciation. Ive been here since day one
Ive been here for all the bad times, so I know the foolishness of trying to shortcut the process The best thing about Garth Snow is that he doesnt listen to the chicken littles, Thats the thing that gives me the greatest Hope for our future.

so you go ahead and piss and moan about the Last 20 years,I know we had clowns running things for much of that, but im not going to complain about the guy who finally said. Enough with the excuses, I may not have a state of the art building, and my owner may be a nut job and others may not have limits like I do on my payroll, but im going to do whats best for this franchise,

thats Garth Snow, and I say hell yeah he's done a good job, no matter what some whiny "I want it now" chicken little says, if you cant see definite progress in spite of things beyond his control you obviously arent looking very hard. and blaming him for the mess things were before, isnt his problem, no matter how much you try to make them his
Mostly agree with your points about doing things differently from how Milbury did them, but who are you lumping into the "idiot" pool? When building you sometimes need to make a change when you hit an unexpected snag. Take Dallas, followed by Tampa, with Mike Smith in mind. Two different teams put him in the "A" prospect pool, only to realize he was as bad as he proved to be, then moved him for other assets. They didn't mindlessly stick with him as the future in net. They also had other needs they identified as more important to fill, and then they did. Whether you are in the early, middle, or late stages of a build you still need to keep the door open for necessary change. It is rare that you get every last vital part of your core in place from the draft. Most? Yes, but rarely does the whole thing cement together from just your draft pool anymore. There is a glaring weakness on defense hence the need for a fix that even the org now acknowledges as needing addressing.

Hamonic is filling in nicely, but CDH is years away from being a top 4 defenseman, and the other defensive prospects in the pool are even further away in development. Streit is a question mark with much to prove this year and will be 34 at the end of the year. How many good years does he have left? Will he even be here if things work out as planned and the club threatens for a cup again one day? It would be great if Snow could simply reach into the tools offered by UFA, but either his hands are tied by Wang and he is lying to us, or it is true that no one wants to come here, or both. Whatever the case may be, the problems on defense still remain and there is only one option left to fix them. Waiting, due to the age of the people you will be waiting on, is not an option.


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