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who doesnt make it?

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Old
09-03-2011, 01:04 PM
  #76
Blubba Jenkins
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Even if we limit his options, that won't stop Tip from giving those kids 1 or 2 minutes a night.

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09-03-2011, 06:38 PM
  #77
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Okay, so let's assume Tikhonov heads to San Jose for a 4th or something.

Let's also assume Bissonnette is scratched most nights.

Which forward helps him eat his nachos most nights? MacLean, Nokelainen, or Pyatt?
McLean. I think the guy's got a long way to go before Tippett trusts him. Giving Turris & Boedker solid ice time is going to be hard enough.

Also, keep in mind those 2 spots will be bottom-6, defensive-minded roles, and I don't see McLean thriving on a shutdown line.

Unless we run into scoring issues, I don't think there's much room for him.

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09-03-2011, 08:55 PM
  #78
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It's not about scoring issues. It's about a woeful lack of offensive pressure and playing in our own zone most of the game. That's why Bryz regularly saw so many shots. It was't poor defense. It was poor offense. Unless Tippett commits to more offense, we'll need Smith to turn into Patrick Roy in a hurry. Even if he does, the product will still be lacking in entertainment.

It started with removing lines years ago, over-penalizing clutching and grabbing and continues with them cracking down on hits this year. The NHL is finally starting to realize more offense will draw in more fans. Tippett needs to adapt or retire. I think Maloney gets it. We'll see if he can bring Tip around. There's no reason why he can't play his system with more offensive talent on the ice. It might be more work and more frustrating as a coach but it will be a hell of a lot more fun to watch.

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09-03-2011, 10:12 PM
  #79
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It's not about scoring issues. It's about a woeful lack of offensive pressure and playing in our own zone most of the game. That's why Bryz regularly saw so many shots. It was't poor defense. It was poor offense. Unless Tippett commits to more offense, we'll need Smith to turn into Patrick Roy in a hurry. Even if he does, the product will still be lacking in entertainment.

It started with removing lines years ago, over-penalizing clutching and grabbing and continues with them cracking down on hits this year. The NHL is finally starting to realize more offense will draw in more fans. Tippett needs to adapt or retire. I think Maloney gets it. We'll see if he can bring Tip around. There's no reason why he can't play his system with more offensive talent on the ice. It might be more work and more frustrating as a coach but it will be a hell of a lot more fun to watch.
Unless Mike Smith becomes the second coming of Jacques Plante and not Patrick Desrochers it all becomes academic.

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09-03-2011, 11:20 PM
  #80
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.......

Which two do you cut? Pyatt, Nokelainen, MacLean, or Tikhonov.

Axe two.....
I feel like MacLean is going to make it this year. I remember Don and Tips both saying he was very close at training camp last year, I could see him working well with Whitney on the power play. I also seem to remember that the word on MacLean was that his defensive game has improved a lot over the past couple of seasons (+5, +13, +13 in less games), so I really think he is going to have a very good chance of making the roster, even if he is in and out of the line up a bit to start.

Personally I much rather see Tiks given a chance over Nokes, Nokes was ordinary at best, and you actually didnt notice him doing much, I think he is there as insurance and to add some pressure for the young fellas. Pyatt is most likely going to make it, but it really depends how the young guns do, if they surprise, he could become trade bait as was alluded to.

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09-03-2011, 11:45 PM
  #81
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With MacLean, it's all about consistency at doing the little things. If he's going to make it,he'll have to start on the checking line and be more aggressive. Once he looks lost/hesitant CoachTip will pull him and lose trust in him. I can't see the Coach trusting (at least at the start the season) that MacLean will put more offensive pressure to substantiate being on a top line (he'll have to earn it). Nokelainen was brought in as insurance and may be the odd man out regardless of a 1 way contract.

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09-03-2011, 11:52 PM
  #82
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Why did they sign Noks again anyway? Was he tearing it up in Europe? Is he there to help our AHL affiliate?

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09-03-2011, 11:58 PM
  #83
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Why did they sign Noks again anyway? Was he tearing it up in Europe? Is he there to help our AHL affiliate?
We have one of the worst penalty kills in the NHL. Nokelainen is an excellent penalty killer. We were utterly run over physically by a relatively soft Detroit squad. Nokelainen never stops engaging in contact. Awesome signing. Thrilled he's back. Pretty much exactly what our bottom lines were in desperate need of. League minimum deal for the exact player we need. Perfect.

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09-04-2011, 12:00 AM
  #84
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We have one of the worst penalty kills in the NHL. Nokelainen is an excellent penalty killer. We were utterly run over physically by a relatively soft Detroit squad. Nokelainen never stops engaging in contact. Awesome signing. Thrilled he's back. Pretty much exactly what our bottom lines were in desperate need of. League minimum deal for the exact player we need. Perfect.
Ah.Thank you.

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09-04-2011, 01:42 AM
  #85
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Kind of making up for what the Coyotes have missed since Winnik left.

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09-04-2011, 03:18 PM
  #86
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Kind of making up for what the Coyotes have missed since Winnik left.
Hated when we got rid of him. One of Maloney's very poor decionsion imo. Winnik was a guy that consistently got better. I'm not saying he was quickly becoming a superstar. He just continued to improve all parts of his game.

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09-04-2011, 03:55 PM
  #87
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It's not like he was that expensive. I would rather have had him on the team over Prucha anyday. One of Maloney's few bad moves.

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09-04-2011, 04:23 PM
  #88
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Didn't Winnik go to arbitration prior to his last year here over something like $100k? Kind of poisoned the well. But we were operating on a nickel and dime budget.

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09-04-2011, 10:45 PM
  #89
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Proposed Tikhonov for Petrecki on the main board. Mixed reviews.

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=978895

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09-04-2011, 11:29 PM
  #90
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Caught Winnik a few times in the ECHL and he looked clearly out of place. In a good way. Just way ahead of the competition. I was impressed by how he developed, but I'm not sure it was a disaster losing him either.
Tikh for Petrecki is exactly the kind of move we should be looking at if he's the odd man out (and I think he is).

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09-04-2011, 11:47 PM
  #91
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I would like to see us add a banger. There are a few teams looking for a vet dman so I don't think it would be too difficult for us to free up a spot or two on D at any time.

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09-04-2011, 11:54 PM
  #92
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I would like to see us add a banger. There are a few teams looking for a vet dman so I don't think it would be too difficult for us to free up a spot or two on D at any time.
Free up a spot? Do you recall how desperate we were to acquire Rozsival and then Klesla later in the season? Remember Don Maloney talking about how long and hard he had to search for those deals? There is a reason these teams need solid vet dmen. We moved Jovo for OEL. I don't think we can afford to lose another vet D.

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09-05-2011, 01:38 AM
  #93
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Free up a spot? Do you recall how desperate we were to acquire Rozsival and then Klesla later in the season? Remember Don Maloney talking about how long and hard he had to search for those deals? There is a reason these teams need solid vet dmen. We moved Jovo for OEL. I don't think we can afford to lose another vet D.
Agreed. Guys like Summers and Gonch will get their shot when the "I word" comes around. Getting rid of one to two veteran defensemen means we have to play 3 guys with little NHL experience. No thanks.

I really hope this year that DT will start to look at other options before Schlemko. I'm still a little disgusted how he continued to dress him last season after terrible games.

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09-05-2011, 10:56 AM
  #94
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Free up a spot? Do you recall how desperate we were to acquire Rozsival and then Klesla later in the season? Remember Don Maloney talking about how long and hard he had to search for those deals? There is a reason these teams need solid vet dmen. We moved Jovo for OEL. I don't think we can afford to lose another vet D.
I disagree. I think we can afford to move Rozsival at this point. He didn't play well for us, and I think his acquisition was primarily because Wolski asked for a trade. We didn't have the depth at defense last year that we do at present. Last year the callup options were very limited. Summers, Goncharov and Stone were NA pro rookies. The best option was Yonkman and after that it dropped off. This year there's Oystrick, Eckford, Arsene and Summers, Goncharov or Stone. The Klesla trade was in part because we knew we were playoff bound and needed the depth and didn't have a defenseman with his skill set. There was no way we were going to be able to re-sign Upshall to the 4 year $14m NTC contract that he got with Florida and they wanted to open up a spot for Boedker. On top of it all, we're still working within a limited budget range and moving Rozsival's $3m salary would provide savings to make moves at the deadline if we're miraculously in it. A guy like Campoli, who we've been rumored to have interest in, is still available and would come cheaper, as would letting one of the other guys get their shot. Internal competition should keep the compete level high.

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09-05-2011, 10:56 AM
  #95
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Free up a spot? Do you recall how desperate we were to acquire Rozsival and then Klesla later in the season? Remember Don Maloney talking about how long and hard he had to search for those deals? There is a reason these teams need solid vet dmen. We moved Jovo for OEL. I don't think we can afford to lose another vet D.
I disagree completely. If we aquire another dman for the roster, we need to move one. Right now it's

Yandle/Morris
Klesla/Rozy
OEL/Aucoin
Schlemko

If we aquire someone that we expect to make the roster, OEL gets bumped. That would be stupid. Plus, if you believe Maloney, Gormley has a shot to make the roster. The coaches love Schlemko. The math right now is 7 guys pretty much locked into positions with a top prospect knocking at the door. Aquire another one and we need to free up a spot. That's without even mentioning Gonch and Summers who are going to come in hungry and fighting.

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09-05-2011, 11:01 AM
  #96
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I disagree. I think we can afford to move Rozsival at this point. He didn't play well for us, and I think his acquisition was primarily because Wolski asked for a trade. We didn't have the depth at defense last year that we do at present. Last year the callup options were very limited. Summers, Goncharov and Stone were NA pro rookies. The best option was Yonkman and after that it dropped off. This year there's Oystrick, Eckford, Arsene and Summers, Goncharov or Stone. The Klesla trade was in part because we knew we were playoff bound and needed the depth and didn't have a defenseman with his skill set. There was no way we were going to be able to re-sign Upshall to the 4 year $14m NTC contract that he got with Florida and they wanted to open up a spot for Boedker. On top of it all, we're still working within a limited budget range and moving Rozsival's $3m salary would provide savings to make moves at the deadline if we're miraculously in it. A guy like Campoli, who we've been rumored to have interest in, is still available and would come cheaper, as would letting one of the other guys get their shot. Internal competition should keep the compete level high.
You stated it better than I did. I think Rozy to the Islanders would make sense for both teams if we just got one of their center prospects in the deal that needed another year or two in the minors. That would free us up to look for an upgrade that's a banger, hopefully shedding a forward or two in the deal.

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09-05-2011, 11:22 AM
  #97
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I think I misinterpreted your post Remo. When you used the word banger, I assumed you meant a
forward. I thought you were suggesting that we move a vet D for a checking line forward.

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09-05-2011, 11:27 AM
  #98
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I guess the difference of opinion here comes about on Rozsival himself. I felt he was a solid vet that could log big minutes in all situations. Occasional brain farts break up long stretches of other wise very solid play.

I could definitely get on board with adding a more physical D, however. I'd prefer to get rid of Schlemko to do it. Not unlike the Tikhonov for Petrecki proposal. If Petrecki looks good in camp, waive Schlemko and assign him to Portland.

Aucoin is ancient and Klesla is extraordinarily injury prone. Those two, along with Rozsival could probably benefit from semi regular healthy scratches. Keep them fresh. A good, solid, physical 7th D would be lovely.

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09-05-2011, 11:57 AM
  #99
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I disagree. I think we can afford to move Rozsival at this point. He didn't play well for us, and I think his acquisition was primarily because Wolski asked for a trade. We didn't have the depth at defense last year that we do at present. Last year the callup options were very limited. Summers, Goncharov and Stone were NA pro rookies. The best option was Yonkman and after that it dropped off. This year there's Oystrick, Eckford, Arsene and Summers, Goncharov or Stone. The Klesla trade was in part because we knew we were playoff bound and needed the depth and didn't have a defenseman with his skill set. There was no way we were going to be able to re-sign Upshall to the 4 year $14m NTC contract that he got with Florida and they wanted to open up a spot for Boedker. On top of it all, we're still working within a limited budget range and moving Rozsival's $3m salary would provide savings to make moves at the deadline if we're miraculously in it. A guy like Campoli, who we've been rumored to have interest in, is still available and would come cheaper, as would letting one of the other guys get their shot. Internal competition should keep the compete level high.
Aucoin is 38. Klesla has averaged 41 games played a season over the last three seasons.

We trade off a vet D now, and lose a couple to injury, and all of the sudden we are utterly doomed.

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09-05-2011, 12:23 PM
  #100
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Aucoin is 38. Klesla has averaged 41 games played a season over the last three seasons.

We trade off a vet D now, and lose a couple to injury, and all of the sudden we are utterly doomed.
Aucoin put up more points, games and TOI than Rosy and at $2.2m -even at age 38 - I'd take him over Rosy.

The injury history of Klesla is worrisome, and I'm not sure he's the shutdown guy we were hoping for. But I think he's more difficult to move because of his contract and I'm more hopeful that, because of his age and other factors, he might be able to turn it around if he can stay healthy.

I'd take Campoli on a one year, $2m deal over Rozsival as well. I'm not necessarily advocating trading off a vet D and leaving a void. I'm suggesting that our D with Campoli instead of Rozsival would be similar, if not improved, and that we might save $1m and pick up a pick in the process. I'm not sure that Rosy has any value on the trade market, but it's worth exploring. And I think it's at least possible that a guy like Gormley could come in and have a rookie season better than Rozsival might be able to offer.

Lastly, we've been without an owner for years and Mike Smith is now our starter. Utterly doomed? We might as well start calling the Job the Temple of Doom.

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