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Old
09-04-2011, 11:50 AM
  #26
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Originally Posted by 19sens11 View Post
Spezza is better than Vanek in every way and is a center. Ottawa would not make that trade straight up.

As for the OP from the Sens' standpoint, the value is alright, but it leaves a huge hole at forward that the Sens cannot fill and will probably spend years trying to fill.
Yup, because Spezza's scored 40 goals before.

There isn't much I'd trade Spezza for, all scenarios including a 1C coming back in some form. EK, Cowen and Rundblad probably won't be on Doughty's level, but I'd rather them + Spezza. Vanek is also useless to the Sens because then his 1C would be Peter Regin...

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09-04-2011, 11:54 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Iamok View Post
Yup, because Spezza's scored 40 goals before.

There isn't much I'd trade Spezza for, all scenarios including a 1C coming back in some form. EK, Cowen and Rundblad probably won't be on Doughty's level, but I'd rather them + Spezza. Vanek is also useless to the Sens because then his 1C would be Peter Regin...
I'm sure if Spezza had played 80 games for the Sabres last year he could have reached 32 goals like Vanek did.

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Old
09-04-2011, 11:56 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by 19sens11 View Post
So you are biased.

The Sabres have lots of scoring wingers. Right now they are forced to play a guy who has only played the wing in NHL in Leino as a top 2 center. Having a Spezza-Roy combo down the middle would be awesome for them. So what if they lose their best LW? They have Leino, Ennis, Gerbe and possibly Hecht.
I dislike him, but that doesn't mean i based the trade on that. It would be great to have Spezza and Roy but i would rather keep our best Sniper and most likely our Captain. And Ott would rather keep their best player. The trade just doesn't make sense for both teams.

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Old
09-04-2011, 11:56 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Iamok View Post
Yup, because Spezza's scored 40 goals before.

There isn't much I'd trade Spezza for, all scenarios including a 1C coming back in some form. EK, Cowen and Rundblad probably won't be on Doughty's level, but I'd rather them + Spezza. Vanek is also useless to the Sens because then his 1C would be Peter Regin...
I'm sure if Spezza played 80 games for the Sabres last year he could have scored 32 goals like Vanek did.

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Old
09-04-2011, 11:57 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by markisonfire View Post
Why not just take LA out of the equation?


Drew Doughty


Thomas Vanek
Shaone Morrisonn


Jason Spezza
Nick Foligno

The Kings are all for this trade.
Looks pretty good. Ottawa does this because they want to get older, want to move Spezza to make room for all their up-and-coming centres ready to step into the #1C role to play with Vanek, want to add Vanek for Spezza because wing is more important than centre and because Vanek is a better all-around player who regularly outproduces Spezza, want to lose cap-space, can afford to give up one of their proven young forwards because they have so many, and want to add a veteran to their not-already-overcrowded blue-line because they don't have any young defencemen they need to make room for.

Someone contact the GMs about this.

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Old
09-04-2011, 12:06 PM
  #31
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Don't want to move Vanek for Spezza at all even with the bonus of unloading Morrisonn and getting Foligno.

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Old
09-04-2011, 01:04 PM
  #32
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I would never in a million years trade Spezza for Doughty, let alone taking on a dump in Morrison and a fringe prospect in Hickey, AND giving up one of the best prospects in the world in Rundblad and a big, gritty, cheap, young winger in Foligno, AND take on cap space. Don't get me wrong, I'd LOVE to have Doughty in a Sens uni, but it makes no sense, because true #1 centers in their prime like Spezza are VERY few and far between. We'd have one of the best offensive D groups in the league with Karlsson, Doughty, and Gonchar (and Kuba if he rebounds), and possibly Wiercioch, but if your #1 center is Regin, Da Costa, or Zibby (who has yet to play a shift in the NHL), it won't matter, you won't score anyway.

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Old
09-04-2011, 01:14 PM
  #33
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I'd take Spezza over Vanek any day of the week. We'll keep the top line C.

Might as well kill the thread, you'll never get Sens fans to go for that.

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Old
09-04-2011, 01:17 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by SpezDispenser View Post
I'd take Spezza over Vanek any day of the week. We'll keep the top line C.

Might as well kill the thread, you'll never get Sens fans to go for that.

Nor Sabre fans. /thread.

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Old
09-04-2011, 01:31 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thefifagod View Post
Don't want to move Vanek for Spezza at all even with the bonus of unloading Morrisonn and getting Foligno.
I dont want anything to do with Spezza for Vanek, however I would be all over Spezza+Foligno for Vanek+ShaMo :

Ennis-Spezza-Stafford
Leino-Roy-Boyes
Foligno-Hecht-Pominville
Gerbe-Gaustad-Kaleta
McCormick

Who ever wouldn't go for that swap is insane even if Buffalo has to add a pick that is one of the finest looking forward corps in the league..

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Old
09-04-2011, 01:36 PM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNBOY View Post
I dont want anything to do with Spezza for Vanek, however I would be all over Spezza+Foligno for Vanek+ShaMo :

Ennis-Spezza-Stafford
Leino-Roy-Boyes
Foligno-Hecht-Pominville
Gerbe-Gaustad-Kaleta
McCormick

Who ever wouldn't go for that swap is insane even if Buffalo has to add a pick that is one of the finest looking forward corps in the league..
I'm sure a deal could be worked out for Nicky to play with his bro, but if you think the sabres could get both he and Spezza for Morrisonn and Vanek....

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Old
09-04-2011, 01:50 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNBOY View Post
I dont want anything to do with Spezza for Vanek, however I would be all over Spezza+Foligno for Vanek+ShaMo :

Ennis-Spezza-Stafford
Leino-Roy-Boyes
Foligno-Hecht-Pominville
Gerbe-Gaustad-Kaleta
McCormick

Who ever wouldn't go for that swap is insane even if Buffalo has to add a pick that is one of the finest looking forward corps in the league..
I'm more content with the forwards that we have now to be honest, call me insane if you'd like. Spezza has missed 14+ games 4 of the last 6 years and I'd rather give Leino a chance at the pivot than put him at wing. While Spezza has immense talent he hasn't produced as much the last 3 seasons and Vanek is coming off his best overall season. Losing Morrisonn is only good for saving space for the next year (we can dump him anyways for a pick or bury him). Kassian, Adam and Marcus Foligno will be up soon enough and personally I'm not a big fan of Nick Foligno's game in comparison to everyone else. Those other guys will be on ELC's where Foligno will be 1.2 million + since he's an RFA after this season, we need every bit of cap space possible. We already took an assumed risk in signing Leino to play center, I want to give him his chance at his natural position that he effectively played last year for Philly even if he started the shift as a wing before I trade our best forward for a center. There's no reason for Ottawa to do this swap and I don't think it's really an improvement for the Sabres either if Leino can play as a top 6 center.

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Old
09-04-2011, 01:51 PM
  #38
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hmmm... I haven't seen much of Doughty playing center. Would he be ready to step in and fill the 1C role on Ottawa?

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Old
09-04-2011, 01:55 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Asquaredx2 View Post
Looks pretty good. Ottawa does this because they want to get older, want to move Spezza to make room for all their up-and-coming centres ready to step into the #1C role to play with Vanek, want to add Vanek for Spezza because wing is more important than centre and because Vanek is a better all-around player who regularly outproduces Spezza, want to lose cap-space, can afford to give up one of their proven young forwards because they have so many, and want to add a veteran to their not-already-overcrowded blue-line because they don't have any young defencemen they need to make room for.

Someone contact the GMs about this.
For the record, my post was a joke in response to the Sabres fan saying he wanted Spezza and Foligno for Vanek and Morrisonn.

The trade just won't work. Ottawa needs Spezza more than they need anything else right now.

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Old
09-04-2011, 03:35 PM
  #40
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Ottawa says no...No way Rundblad AND Spezza only get us Doughty

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Old
09-04-2011, 06:03 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 19sens11 View Post
So you are biased.

The Sabres have lots of scoring wingers. Right now they are forced to play a guy who has only played the wing in NHL in Leino as a top 2 center. Having a Spezza-Roy combo down the middle would be awesome for them. So what if they lose their best LW? They have Leino, Ennis, Gerbe and possibly Hecht.
just because someone doesn't like a player doesn't mean they're biased.

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Old
09-04-2011, 06:25 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by OmniSens View Post
Ottawa says no...No way Rundblad AND Spezza only get us Doughty
...yup.

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Old
09-04-2011, 06:40 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shanny View Post
I'm sure a deal could be worked out for Nicky to play with his bro, but if you think the sabres could get both he and Spezza for Morrisonn and Vanek....
True, actually Morrisonn has negative value. I was just making a point to fellow Sabre fans that if that proposal was offered we would be inclined to say yes here in "HF LaLa Land" ..

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Old
09-04-2011, 08:43 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Iamok View Post
Yup, because Spezza's scored 40 goals before.

There isn't much I'd trade Spezza for, all scenarios including a 1C coming back in some form. EK, Cowen and Rundblad probably won't be on Doughty's level, but I'd rather them + Spezza. Vanek is also useless to the Sens because then his 1C would be Peter Regin...
Yea because Vanek didn't produce this year with Hecht and Niedermayer at center. As for Vanek and Spezza, I would say they have pretty much equal value. Spezza may be slightly higher because of his position.

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Old
09-04-2011, 08:58 PM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Asquaredx2 View Post
Looks pretty good. Ottawa does this because they want to get older, want to move Spezza to make room for all their up-and-coming centres ready to step into the #1C role to play with Vanek, want to add Vanek for Spezza because wing is more important than centre and because Vanek is a better all-around player who regularly outproduces Spezza, want to lose cap-space, can afford to give up one of their proven young forwards because they have so many, and want to add a veteran to their not-already-overcrowded blue-line because they don't have any young defencemen they need to make room for.

Someone contact the GMs about this.
Pretty much.

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Old
09-04-2011, 11:06 PM
  #46
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I would never in a million years trade Spezza for Doughty, let alone taking on a dump in Morrison and a fringe prospect in Hickey, AND giving up one of the best prospects in the world in Rundblad and a big, gritty, cheap, young winger in Foligno, AND take on cap space. Don't get me wrong, I'd LOVE to have Doughty in a Sens uni, but it makes no sense, because true #1 centers in their prime like Spezza are VERY few and far between. We'd have one of the best offensive D groups in the league with Karlsson, Doughty, and Gonchar (and Kuba if he rebounds), and possibly Wiercioch, but if your #1 center is Regin, Da Costa, or Zibby (who has yet to play a shift in the NHL), it won't matter, you won't score anyway.
That said, if there was any possibility of making another deal in which we'd be able to ship out a Karlsson/Rundblad/Cowen for a young-ish centre to step in for Spezza then I'd trade Jason for Doughty in a heartbeat. DD is still a possible generational talent IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by markisonfire View Post
For the record, my post was a joke in response to the Sabres fan saying he wanted Spezza and Foligno for Vanek and Morrisonn.

The trade just won't work. Ottawa needs Spezza more than they need anything else right now.
Haha, yeah, I know. I think it still behooved us to outline the number of ways it didn't make sense for Ottawa.

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Old
09-04-2011, 11:57 PM
  #47
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Originally Posted by Asquaredx2 View Post
That said, if there was any possibility of making another deal in which we'd be able to ship out a Karlsson/Rundblad/Cowen for a young-ish centre to step in for Spezza then I'd trade Jason for Doughty in a heartbeat. DD is still a possible generational talent IMO.



Haha, yeah, I know. I think it still behooved us to outline the number of ways it didn't make sense for Ottawa.

---------------------------

what a great word.... "behooved" ..lol

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Old
09-05-2011, 12:27 AM
  #48
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This doesn't make sense from either teams view..... not because the value is off. But because the reason why the SAbres would want Spezza would be to set up VAnek and Vice-Versa. These two are the likely next captains of their respective teams and I don't see either team wanting to trade their player for the other.

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Old
09-05-2011, 12:32 AM
  #49
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Buffalo fans seem to really overrate Foligno. He really isn't very good.

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Old
09-05-2011, 01:30 AM
  #50
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hmmm... I haven't seen much of Doughty playing center. Would he be ready to step in and fill the 1C role on Ottawa?
Aren't most people?

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