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Scott Stevens' Hits in Todays NHL

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09-04-2011, 04:27 PM
  #1
GreatGonzo
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Scott Stevens' Hits in Todays NHL

Scott Stevens was well known for being a vicious hitter. He, in my opinion is the best open ice hitter and very well may be the best hitter to ever play the game. My question to you guys is would Scott Steven's hits be legal in today's NHL with all its new rules and regulations regarding hits to the head and in general, and if so, would it lessen his dominance?

Just some vids for the thread



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09-04-2011, 04:53 PM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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The Kariya hit would probably be a 5 minute interference call since it was somewhat late.

The rest of his famous hits would be legal under last year's rules (Nobody seems to know exactly what the rule will be next season). They were generally from the front, involved a guy who had the puck or was in the process of getting rid of it, and didn't involve an elbow or upward motion before contact is made.

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09-04-2011, 08:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SharkLoc91 View Post
My question to you guys is would Scott Steven's hits be legal in today's NHL with all its new rules and regulations regarding hits to the head and in general, and if so, would it lessen his dominance?
As someone who watched his entire career, my answers are, in order:

Depending on which hits you mean, no, some certainly would not be legal in today's game. But that is no reflection on the player; it is a reflection on the evolution (or de-evolution, if one prefers) of the NHL.

And, yes, he would be as dominant. Dynamic, as in: highlight hits? No. But it is important to note that over the last portion of his career, Stevens refined his game considerably from his first decade (with the Caps). That is to say, through his 20s, he hit everything that moved...and at times put himself out of position doing so.

With age and experience, came wisdom and a refining of his game. While he still hit a lot, he picked his spots and likewise was GREAT positionally. Of course, he held nothing back come the postseason and the legendary playoff hits with NJD speak to that. In my mind, the single most valuable player of the playoffs, 1995-2003, a time when a single hit could still change a game, a series, entirely. (Sadly, that aspect has pretty much been lost in the kinder and gentler, post-modern NHL.)

BTW - in my time, he and Denis Potvin rank 1-2 (pick either one) for open ice hitting among dmen.

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09-04-2011, 09:24 PM
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The Kariya hit was late; I would have given him an interference penalty for it.

Otherwise, as pointed out above, in general his hits were from the front, did not involve the elbow, weren't directed at the head and were usually on guys who had the puck or were just getting rid of it. Very hard hits but clean by all definition. In general Stevens would use his positioning to force an opponent to skate into him.

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09-04-2011, 09:28 PM
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Iain Fyffe
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Originally Posted by Trottier View Post
Depending on which hits you mean, no, some certainly would not be legal in today's game. But that is no reflection on the player; it is a reflection on the evolution (or de-evolution, if one prefers) of the NHL.
Agreed. But evolution just means change, not progress along a hierarchy assuming an ideal end point. Thus de-evolution is nonsensicle.

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09-04-2011, 09:53 PM
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The Kariya hit was late; I would have given him an interference penalty for it.

Otherwise, as pointed out above, in general his hits were from the front, did not involve the elbow, weren't directed at the head and were usually on guys who had the puck or were just getting rid of it. Very hard hits but clean by all definition. In general Stevens would use his positioning to force an opponent to skate into him.
Well, one thing that would not fly in today's NHL is the manner in which Steven's defensive partner would usually clutch, grab, and steer them into Stevens.

A few of his hits were blindside hits as well.

But in general, he was a beast.

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09-04-2011, 10:37 PM
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Trottier
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Originally Posted by Iain Fyffe View Post
Agreed. But evolution just means change, not progress along a hierarchy assuming an ideal end point. Thus de-evolution is nonsensicle.
OK, then how about "sterilization" of the NHL? I was attempting to avoid provoking a prolonged, off-topic kneejerk defense of today's kinder and gentler game.


Last edited by Trottier: 09-04-2011 at 10:42 PM.
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09-04-2011, 11:15 PM
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Only thing that made any of his hits blindside were the victim's head being turned. He hit from the front, all clean, brutal, perfect hits! THAT'S HOCKEY ************!!!!

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09-05-2011, 12:27 AM
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Timmer44
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Yes, he would have had to hold back.




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09-05-2011, 12:47 AM
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GreatGonzo
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Yes, he would have had to hold back.



You cannot compare these two hits. Rome's hit was a very very late cheap shot. Steven's hit was interference.

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09-05-2011, 11:27 AM
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I think there are too many people who get their panties in a knot nowadays and even a hit like Lindros' would send a wave of posts on these boards and over analysis. But are they legal? Like someone mentioned, the Kariya one was a little late and was even questioned as being late in 2003. The others are fine even to today's standards

Lindros in 2000 - legal
Willis/Francis 2001 - perfectly legal
Kozlov 1995 - legal

Could Stevens have let up on any of these guys and not hit them? Of course he could have. But I'll throw you out a stat:

Number of Cups for Stevens - 3
Number of Cups for Lindros - 0

Maybe Stevens is a "meanie" by Michael Lansberg or (pick a writer on the Hockey News) standards but that doesn't mean he wasn't playing the game legally. None of his hits are blindsided. Some guys have their heads down but keep in mind the culture of the NHL (like society) is not to blame the puck carrier anymore but the hitter. No one can take responsibility anymore for things and that is what is killing the physical aspect of the NHL. Lindros was in the wrong in 2000. Sorry, but he was. This is Game 7, if Stevens doesn't hit him watch the play very, very closely, you could easily see a promising rush going against Brodeur. This is why Stevens is a champion and a warrior, he knew how to win and what it took to win. Lindros did not.

By the way, was Horton also in the wrong in 2011? Yes he was. Rome threw a borderline late hit but if Horton has his head up he gets up after that hit.

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09-05-2011, 08:58 PM
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Dennis Bonvie
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Originally Posted by Hoser View Post
The Kariya hit was late; I would have given him an interference penalty for it.

Otherwise, as pointed out above, in general his hits were from the front, did not involve the elbow, weren't directed at the head and were usually on guys who had the puck or were just getting rid of it. Very hard hits but clean by all definition. In general Stevens would use his positioning to force an opponent to skate into him.
Looked to me like all of them were directed to the head.

Either that or he missed a lot.

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09-05-2011, 09:01 PM
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Yes, he would have had to hold back.



That's not a blindside hit to the head?

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09-05-2011, 09:23 PM
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vadim sharifijanov
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i always wondered whether niedermayer or one of stevens' other partners ever got a concussion from one of those giant hits.

on two separate occasions this season, dan hamhuis got hurt when his partner kevin bieksa hit a guy. with how hard and how often he hit, how did stevens never inadvertently kill a teammate?

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09-05-2011, 09:27 PM
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That's not a blindside hit to the head?
Late and blind.

Stevens hit with the intention of injuring guys and that is why he'll always be down a notch in my books.

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09-06-2011, 12:06 AM
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Late and blind.

Stevens hit with the intention of injuring guys and that is why he'll always be down a notch in my books.
You're failing to make a distinction between "causing pain" and "actually injuring" guys. Stevens hit with the intention of causing pain - and it forced opponents to play a certain way to the benefit of Stevens' team. But he didn't intend to actually cause serious injury. Any of the articles about how he was in tears and had to be comforted by his coach (the former great big hitter Larry Robinson) after the famous Lindros hit would tell you that.

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09-06-2011, 05:35 PM
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Dennis Bonvie
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
You're failing to make a distinction between "causing pain" and "actually injuring" guys. Stevens hit with the intention of causing pain - and it forced opponents to play a certain way to the benefit of Stevens' team. But he didn't intend to actually cause serious injury. Any of the articles about how he was in tears and had to be comforted by his coach (the former great big hitter Larry Robinson) after the famous Lindros hit would tell you that.
He was certainly more careful after that.

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09-06-2011, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
You're failing to make a distinction between "causing pain" and "actually injuring" guys. Stevens hit with the intention of causing pain - and it forced opponents to play a certain way to the benefit of Stevens' team. But he didn't intend to actually cause serious injury. Any of the articles about how he was in tears and had to be comforted by his coach (the former great big hitter Larry Robinson) after the famous Lindros hit would tell you that.
Stevens wasn't a dirty hitter it was the devils system that made his hits dirty. Devils took full advantage of holding/hooking/steering someone into Stevens which then annihilated the poor sap.

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09-06-2011, 06:39 PM
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Stevens wasn't a dirty hitter it was the devils system that made his hits dirty. Devils took full advantage of holding/hooking/steering someone into Stevens which then annihilated the poor sap.
A misconception about the Devils.

Consistently one of the least penalized teams in the league.

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09-06-2011, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Dennis Bonvie View Post
A misconception about the Devils.

Consistently one of the least penalized teams in the league.
Those things not being called is why we ended up with the garbage era of hockey between lockouts.

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09-06-2011, 07:30 PM
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Stevens wasn't a dirty hitter it was the devils system that made his hits dirty. Devils took full advantage of holding/hooking/steering someone into Stevens which then annihilated the poor sap.
Indeed. I mentioned as much above. Most hits in his top 10 video involve watching his defensive partner clutch, hook, and steer them right into an oncoming Stevens.

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Originally Posted by Dennis Bonvie View Post
A misconception about the Devils.

Consistently one of the least penalized teams in the league.
I am sure you recall that they almost never called clutching and grabbing unless the puck carrier was literally hauled down. The video shows it happening in abundance.

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Those things not being called is why we ended up with the garbage era of hockey between lockouts.
Exactly.

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09-06-2011, 07:34 PM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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Of course the Devils clutched and grabbed - everyone did. And yeah, if clutching and grabbing is allowed, they'd be stupid not to use it to direct players to Stevens' side of the ice.

I always thought the Devils clutched and grabbed less than other teams, because they were usually in better defensive position (The Trap!), but of course I was biased.

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09-06-2011, 10:30 PM
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Dennis Bonvie
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Of course the Devils clutched and grabbed - everyone did. And yeah, if clutching and grabbing is allowed, they'd be stupid not to use it to direct players to Stevens' side of the ice.

I always thought the Devils clutched and grabbed less than other teams, because they were usually in better defensive position (The Trap!), but of course I was biased.
In this case you were correct, bias aside.

I was always amazed at how little the Devils interfered as compared to other teams. They played great team defense and were in better position than any other teams. People can claim they were the cause of the clutch & grab era ending but if you watched them play alot you would know its not true.

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09-06-2011, 11:36 PM
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Originally Posted by TheDevilMadeMe View Post
You're failing to make a distinction between "causing pain" and "actually injuring" guys. Stevens hit with the intention of causing pain - and it forced opponents to play a certain way to the benefit of Stevens' team. But he didn't intend to actually cause serious injury. Any of the articles about how he was in tears and had to be comforted by his coach (the former great big hitter Larry Robinson) after the famous Lindros hit would tell you that.
Stevens knew what he was doing, he blurred the line between causing pain and actually injuring guys and hid behind the former to do the latter within the rules. Still wrong.

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Old
09-07-2011, 12:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Dennis Bonvie View Post
In this case you were correct, bias aside.

I was always amazed at how little the Devils interfered as compared to other teams. They played great team defense and were in better position than any other teams. People can claim they were the cause of the clutch & grab era ending but if you watched them play alot you would know its not true.
One could argue that they were (partially) indirectly responsible. I.e. teams saw the success that the Devils had with their defensive style, and most lacked the personnel/coaching to execute the Devils system, thus resorting to clutch and grab. Certainly not the Devils' fault, just an extreme case of the NHL's tendency to imitate the winners. Also, there were a couple of other teams that played good positional defense, so the Devils wouldn't be the only team being copied (Detroit, Colorado).

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