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Consequences of Yaroslavl plane crash for the KHL

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Old
09-09-2011, 02:35 PM
  #26
Peter25
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Originally Posted by Latgale_fan View Post
Twith big NA sports networks coming up with crazy theories of how unsafe flying in Russia is and how foreign players won't ever come to KHL again.
It does not really matter if flying in Russia was generally safe (which it is not compared to many other countries) if the image is tarnished. A whole KHL club was killed in a single plane crash. This must have a great psychological impact on each (especially foreign) player that is either already playing in the KHL or thinking about moving to play in the KHL.

If I was a hockey player considering to move to the KHL I would have to take this into a serious consideration after what happened.

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09-09-2011, 02:40 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Latgale_fan View Post
And you don't need to worry about Russia's hockey resources as the players who started to train in 2000s are coming in when there were a lot of new ice rinks built and economic situation got better so the quality of Russian prospects will only improve year by year, the same goes for Latvia... you'll see a few first round prospects from us in the coming years...
I hope you are right on this. I am one of the biggest non Russian fans of Russian hockey on this board and I have been concerned about the level of young Russian players (especially d-men and goalies) lately. I have read that players born in 1995 (and maybe after) are better than players born in 1987-1994.

This is just a guess, but one reason for this might be that players born in 1995 and after had better diets as kids than those born earlier because economics started to get better after 1999. Russian kids born after mid 1990's are stronger and better fed than kids from previous age groups.

Of course the building of new rinks had a big effect too.


Last edited by Peter25: 09-09-2011 at 04:41 PM.
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09-09-2011, 03:20 PM
  #28
Soldiers from Neva
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Originally Posted by wjhl2009fan View Post
Latgale_fan
While i think some network are going on a bit to much the thing is it can be a good thing it bring to light this awful accident and maybe changes need to be made to how planes are kept up etc
It goes much deeper than that. It is a sociological topic that pertains to Russian society. It is easy to say 'changes should be made' but implementing anything is difficult. We have 3 separate generations in this country that view the world in 3 different ways. Society is changing but it is a slow process. It will take another full generation to finally be rid of all the Soviet mentality in administrations and the 90s mentality of 'if it doesn't effect me it doesn't matter' Of course these are generalizations and not everyone is this way, but these attitudes are extremely prevalent, and must be removed before the bloated bureaucratic mess can be streamlined and progress can be made.

Hopefully this and the recent crashes can end the apathy, but if the situation after the fires last summer is any indication, I wouldn't hold my breath.

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09-09-2011, 04:51 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Soldiers from Neva View Post
and the 90s mentality
The "yoke" of 1990's still plagues Russia very much. The rise of Putin to power did not get Russia rid of many problems that were created during Yeltsin period and many of these problems still exist today. Corruption is the biggest of them (corruption and greed may have caused the Yaroslavl crash if the fuel was indeed sub-standard as early study showed).

Also, the current president Dimitri Medvedev is gullible and weak and this should be his last and only term in office. He continues to be mesmerized by the West even if the West has betrayed him in many occasions (the Ossetian war, continued blockade from the WTO, the conquest of Libya where Russian interests were completely ignored etc.). Medvedev is not a right guy to lead Russia at it's current state. They need someone like Putin or Sergei Ivanov.

Russia is still in a transition period and it will be at least one more decade before Russia can be called a truly independent, self-reliant state. Any war or revolution would mess this process. Luckily there are nukes.

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09-09-2011, 05:01 PM
  #30
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The "yoke" of 1990's still plagues Russia very much. The rise of Putin to power did not get Russia rid of many problems that were created during Yeltsin period and many of these problems still exist today. Corruption is the biggest of them (corruption and greed may have caused the Yaroslavl crash if the fuel was indeed sub-standard as early study showed).

Also, the current president Dimitri Medvedev is gullible and weak and this should be his last and only term in office. He continues to be mesmerized by the West even if the West has betrayed him in many occasions (the Ossetian war, continued blockade from the WTO, the conquest of Libya where Russian interests were completely ignored etc.). Medvedev is not a right guy to lead Russia at it's current state. They need someone like Putin or Sergei Ivanov.

Russia is still in a transition period and it will be at least one more decade before Russia can be called a truly independent, self-reliant state. Any war or revolution would mess this process. Luckily there are nukes.
This is rapidly going outside the scope of this forum, but we need a 1999 Putin not a 2011 Putin who has become lost in his super hero persona. Last year he was showing off flying a plane putting out fires in front of reporters, when really he should have been doing his job before hand so safeguards would have been in place and up to code to prevent those fires from getting that bad.

And that is my last statement of that subject.

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09-09-2011, 05:09 PM
  #31
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This is rapidly going outside the scope of this forum, but we need a 1999 Putin not a 2011 Putin
Or maybe Russia needs a whole new person to lead the country? I agree that Putin has changed over the years and not for the better. In 1999 he was a tough SOB who brought Caucasus and the oligarchs under control, and basically pulled Russia out of disintegration. Today he is not the same man. He has grown older, richer and lazier.

I still like Putin but I can also see that he is getting old and Russia needs new younger blood. Just keep the liberasts out of power. And Medvedev must go.

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09-09-2011, 05:24 PM
  #32
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Or maybe Russia needs a whole new person to lead the country? I agree that Putin has changed over the years and not for the better. In 1999 he was a tough SOB who brought Caucasus and the oligarchs under control, and basically pulled Russia out of disintegration. Today he is not the same man. He has grown older, richer and lazier.

I still like Putin but I can also see that he is getting old and Russia needs new younger blood. Just keep the liberasts out of power. And Medvedev must go.
If we would just dispose of this bloated redundant soviet times bureaucratic nightmare in every level of society the corruption and bribes and needs to cut corners would die on their own. When it is a 9 hour process to do a 2 hour job (in a western country) as per a repair of an airplane corners get cut. We need a leader that will take to that task. Then you won't see airplanes falling out of the sky because of poor maintenance or be cause a pilot bought his last 50 hours of qualification time.

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09-09-2011, 05:33 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Soldiers from Neva View Post
If we would just dispose of this bloated redundant soviet times bureaucratic nightmare in every level of society the corruption and bribes and needs to cut corners would die on their own. When it is a 9 hour process to do a 2 hour job (in a western country) as per a repair of an airplane corners get cut. We need a leader that will take to that task. Then you won't see airplanes falling out of the sky because of poor maintenance or be cause a pilot bought his last 50 hours of qualification time.
It should start from the bottom. The normal citizens should refuse to pay bribes to policemen, teachers and doctors. Blaming the politicians does not help if the "average Ivan" will pay the bribes.

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09-10-2011, 05:21 AM
  #34
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It's really not a time to search for enemies.

BTW. Where are those stories about how bad Russia is according to "enemies"?
NHL.com is filled with tribute videos.
Well... I am overreacting, that's a fact. NHL.com have been really great and I have nothing bad to say about them but there are some media who want to make it all about the problem with planes and how foreigners will never come to KHL again, than to offer condolances.... Maybe it's coming from US media mostly, again I can't be sure because I've heard about it from Russian media...

Anyway, there's much to be improved in Russia- that's no doubt. It's just... out of all clubs that crashed it was "Lokomotiv'', one of the finest organizations of KHL in every damn aspect... and that's even more painful. I'm not trying to accuse somebody etc. but there are few organizations in KHL where MAYBE you could think that the club was poor and the planes they were flying with were old and in bad condition but it's just not about "Lokomotiv"- everything was of top quality in that team, everybody said that... It wasn't like in some NA media where sombody said they had to almost sleep on the floor while flying in Russia.... it was a good plane, specially modified for a hockey team....

It's bad when something like that happens... it's even more painful when you realize that people worked so hard to be among the best in the league IN EVERY ASPECT, that they expected a great season, it was probably on of the top 3 rosters in the league this season with no weak spots visible, everything was done for the fans and players.... and this thing happens

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09-11-2011, 04:49 AM
  #35
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KHL ask people about Loko´s destiny...
http://www.khl.ru/news/2011/09/11/33482.html

here it is http://www.hotice.ru/opros/

Считаете ли вы, что будет лучше, если команда «Локомотив» начнет выступления в чемпионате КХЛ не позднее 30 сентября 2011 года?
Do you think it would be better if Loko started in KHL not later than 30.9. 2011?

Считаете ли вы, что будет лучше, если команда «Локомотив» примет участие в чемпионате КХЛ в сезоне 2012/2013?
Do you think it would be better if Loko started in KHL in season 2012/13?

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09-11-2011, 07:13 AM
  #36
Helpoing
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It is pretty obvious to me that Loko should spend a year slowly recovering. No need to rush it, let them heal the wounds. The town will still have a MHL team, so it's not like there will be no hockey for the fans.

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09-12-2011, 10:42 AM
  #37
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From Sovsport:
1. Lokomotiv won't play in the KHL in 11/12.
2. Starting with December Yaroslavl will participate in the VHL (next tier league in Russia), and will have a guaranteed playoff spot.
3. Lokomotiv will return to the KHL in 12/13 and will also have a guaranteed playoff spot.

Who thought it's a good idea to give Lokomotiv a bye to the playoffs next year?

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09-12-2011, 11:49 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Helpoing View Post
From Sovsport:
1. Lokomotiv won't play in the KHL in 11/12.
2. Starting with December Yaroslavl will participate in the VHL (next tier league in Russia), and will have a guaranteed playoff spot.
3. Lokomotiv will return to the KHL in 12/13 and will also have a guaranteed playoff spot.

Who thought it's a good idea to give Lokomotiv a bye to the playoffs next year?
i think it is

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09-12-2011, 01:14 PM
  #39
Helpoing
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i think it is
Would you please elaborate how? From my point of view, victory needs to be earned, otherwise it doesn't taste sweet. I somehow think that athletes feel the same way.

If you really want to help Lokomotiv then simply give them money, allow them to bring more than 5 foreigners (they are about to raise it to 6 for Loko), give them high draft picks (or conduct a rehab draft). A bye is not an answer; especially, for the next season. If I were a Loko fan I'd be offended by such a decision.

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09-12-2011, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Helpoing View Post
Would you please elaborate how? From my point of view, victory needs to be earned, otherwise it doesn't taste sweet. I somehow think that athletes feel the same way.

If you really want to help Lokomotiv then simply give them money, allow them to bring more than 5 foreigners (they are about to raise it to 6 for Loko), give them high draft picks (or conduct a rehab draft). A bye is not an answer; especially, for the next season. If I were a Loko fan I'd be offended by such a decision.

i was actually thinking it could be an option for this season if they would have played this season, its not easy to rebuild a team of that quality that quick, plus as a gesture to the fans, the city i think its a right step, they can use every support they can get

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09-12-2011, 02:17 PM
  #41
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....


Last edited by NMF78: 09-12-2011 at 02:18 PM. Reason: double post
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09-12-2011, 03:44 PM
  #42
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@NMF78
They won't play in the KHL this year.

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09-12-2011, 03:51 PM
  #43
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@NMF78
They won't play in the KHL this year.
i know

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09-12-2011, 05:49 PM
  #44
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Hope the rehab draft will become more clear.

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09-13-2011, 05:49 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by Helpoing View Post
Would you please elaborate how? From my point of view, victory needs to be earned, otherwise it doesn't taste sweet. I somehow think that athletes feel the same way.

If you really want to help Lokomotiv then simply give them money, allow them to bring more than 5 foreigners (they are about to raise it to 6 for Loko), give them high draft picks (or conduct a rehab draft). A bye is not an answer; especially, for the next season. If I were a Loko fan I'd be offended by such a decision.
I agree with you on "victory needs to be earned", that's under normal circumstances. However they lost entire team and it is extremely difficult for the organization to field a team competitive out of no where within a year. The management probably won't start looking into rebuilding the team for next few months or so. It is a very tragic accident, give them a break. I don't mind giving the team a guarantee spot. Just think of it as a tribute from entire KHL to those players/coaching staffs who lost their lives.

Just like the previous poster said, the city needs every support they can get.

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09-13-2011, 09:33 AM
  #46
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I agree with you on "victory needs to be earned", that's under normal circumstances. However they lost entire team and it is extremely difficult for the organization to field a team competitive out of no where within a year. The management probably won't start looking into rebuilding the team for next few months or so. It is a very tragic accident, give them a break. I don't mind giving the team a guarantee spot. Just think of it as a tribute from entire KHL to those players/coaching staffs who lost their lives.

Just like the previous poster said, the city needs every support they can get.
Knowing what their future coach Vorobyov can do with a young team - they'll be in without a bye. But still my point is that most Loko fans will reject such a decision.

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