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Do you think Niedermeyer is worth $7 million?

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08-17-2004, 10:12 PM
  #1
CrookedRain
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Do you think Niedermeyer is worth $7 million?

I watch pretty much every Rangers game and as many Devils games as I can so I've seen Niedermeyer play for the last 10 years or so and I don't think he's worth the money the arbitrator awarded him. I was wondering what anyone else here thought.

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08-17-2004, 10:13 PM
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gkrangers
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He's worth more.

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08-17-2004, 10:15 PM
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based on comparable players he is vastly underpaid...the devils got extremely lucky, the arbitrator gave him LESS than the devils reportedly offered...

he should be making the same $10 mil that pronger & lidstrom get

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08-17-2004, 11:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR469
based on comparable players he is vastly underpaid...the devils got extremely lucky, the arbitrator gave him LESS than the devils reportedly offered...

he should be making the same $10 mil that pronger & lidstrom get
I think around 8.5/9 a year is just. He's not as good as Lidstrom in my eyes.

And I don't think Pronger is worth the money he's making. He should be around 7/8.

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08-17-2004, 11:15 PM
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CrookedRain
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I suppose that this is sort of relative. After all, if Bobby Holik is worth 9 million then Niedermayer is worth $7. And, ultimately, youíre only worth what someone is willing to pay for you but even that statement comes with its own set of problems.

Given the state of the league (I understand it made $70 million worth of profit last year) I fail to see how a player who averages 40 points per season and is by no stretch of the imagination the best defenseman in the league worth $7 million dollars per year. And let me qualify that by saying I donít agree with the Holik contract, either. And I am also fully aware that the Devils had offered him $8 million per season (although I donít know the particulars of the contract).

I see Niedermayer play around 50-60 games per season and I have never been blown away by him. He is not as skilled as Leetch, Lidstrom or Gonchar. He is not as dominating as Pronger and Hatcher were before their injuriesÖ Basically, what he is is a very steady defenseman who shines offensively on a team devoid of other offensive defensmen. I donít think heís worth it.

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08-17-2004, 11:19 PM
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Yes, he is. I'd rank him just behind Lidstrom as the best in the league. He's got the speed, quickness, and smarts to D-up to anybody in the league, and his offensive-prowess is second only to Gonchar.

He _might_ be able to run Federov or Kapanen down on any breakaways... I'd say, he's easily worth that 7.

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08-17-2004, 11:19 PM
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He might not be as flashy as the other guys, but he is quietly the Devils best player besides Brodeur for many years. He's better than Stevens, by far, IMO. You don't need to notice him to know how well he plays the game. He's one of the best two-way defenseman in the game. He's quietly made it up to super-star calibur and he finally got noticed this year.

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08-17-2004, 11:24 PM
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I think it's a loaded question because no one in the league is worth the money they make. Compared to his peers it is a little lower than he's probably worth.

Compared to what the NHL's salary structure should be, he's overpaid like everyone else.

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08-17-2004, 11:44 PM
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in the hall
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I have watched my fair share of devil games as well and while I admit Neidermayer is very good and a #1 defenseman, he is way overrated by NHL fans

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08-18-2004, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by in the hall
I have watched my fair share of devil games as well and while I admit Neidermayer is very good and a #1 defenseman, he is way overrated by NHL fans
How can he be overrated when hes not recognized by the masses as the superstar caliber player that he is?

He is one of the top 5 dmen in the league, and thats being conservative. I put him right up there with Lidstrom. He is a dominant player. He can do it all, and he can do it all just as good or better than everyone else.

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08-18-2004, 07:33 AM
  #11
in the hall
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gkrangers
How can he be overrated when hes not recognized by the masses as the superstar caliber player that he is?
he wasn't two years ago but he sure is now after his SCF, and now it's been overblown

he is not better or as good as Pronger, Lidstrom etc

Quote:
He is one of the top 5 dmen in the league, and thats being conservative. I put him right up there with Lidstrom. He is a dominant player. He can do it all, and he can do it all just as good or better than everyone else.
he is a dominant all around defenseman, however, he is not on the level top all time greatness such as those two are

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08-18-2004, 08:30 AM
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He stepped it up last season...

prior to that, I didn't see much difference in him and, say, Teppo Numminen. He wasn't the guy facing top lines on a regular basis throughout his career and has been surrounded by a great system and a great cast. His offensive numbers have never been off the charts also. But like I said, he was a better all-around player last season than I've seen him in his previous years. $7 million? That's a lot.

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08-18-2004, 08:43 AM
  #13
gkrangers
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That great system and "great cast" holds him back offensively.

Chris Pronger is a friggin joke for the money he makes...

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08-18-2004, 08:43 AM
  #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrookedRain
I watch pretty much every Rangers game and as many Devils games as I can so I've seen Niedermeyer play for the last 10 years or so and I don't think he's worth the money the arbitrator awarded him. I was wondering what anyone else here thought.
He's worth it if someone is willing to pay him it.

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08-18-2004, 09:04 AM
  #15
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Holds him back offensively?

That's what people said back in 1995. The Devils are perennially near the tops in scoring in the league, and I believe two seasons ago were the top point-getter.

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08-18-2004, 09:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrookedRain
I suppose that this is sort of relative. After all, if Bobby Holik is worth 9 million then Niedermayer is worth $7. And, ultimately, youíre only worth what someone is willing to pay for you but even that statement comes with its own set of problems.

Given the state of the league (I understand it made $70 million worth of profit last year) I fail to see how a player who averages 40 points per season and is by no stretch of the imagination the best defenseman in the league worth $7 million dollars per year. And let me qualify that by saying I donít agree with the Holik contract, either. And I am also fully aware that the Devils had offered him $8 million per season (although I donít know the particulars of the contract).

I see Niedermayer play around 50-60 games per season and I have never been blown away by him. He is not as skilled as Leetch, Lidstrom or Gonchar. He is not as dominating as Pronger and Hatcher were before their injuriesÖ Basically, what he is is a very steady defenseman who shines offensively on a team devoid of other offensive defensmen. I donít think heís worth it.
Listen, I know it's hard to talk to fans of rival teams...but how can you say the Devils have been "devoid of offensive defenseman"??? PLease look at their roster from this year and years past..It's just not true.

Also, not as talented as Gonchar???? I think most GM's would disagree with your assessments of talent. Defenseman are players who play both offense and defense and Nieds does that as well as any player in the league right now. That's why he has the Norris.

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08-18-2004, 09:43 AM
  #17
in the hall
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerseydevil
Listen, I know it's hard to talk to fans of rival teams...but how can you say the Devils have been "devoid of offensive defenseman"??? PLease look at their roster from this year and years past..It's just not true.

Also, not as talented as Gonchar???? I think most GM's would disagree with your assessments of talent. Defenseman are players who play both offense and defense and Nieds does that as well as any player in the league right now. That's why he has the Norris.
talent is skill, Gonchar is more talented doesn't mean he's the better player

all it means is if Gonchar takes a shot from the point, it's coming in 10 mph faster and more accurate

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08-18-2004, 10:01 AM
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jerseydevil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by in the hall
talent is skill, Gonchar is more talented doesn't mean he's the better player

all it means is if Gonchar takes a shot from the point, it's coming in 10 mph faster and more accurate
So by your assessment..Al Iafrate is one of the most talented hockey player of the last century...C'mon you can't compare Gonchar and Niedermayer as all around talents.

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08-18-2004, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CrookedRain
...I fail to see how a player who averages 40 points per season and is by no stretch of the imagination the best defenseman in the league worth $7 million dollars per year.
You might want to tell that to the boneheads who awarded him the Norris Trophy last season

It always cracked me up when Rangers fans would go on about how Brodeaur wasn't really that good a goalie. Now, I guess it's Niedermeyer's turn.

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08-18-2004, 11:16 AM
  #20
in the hall
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jerseydevil
So by your assessment..Al Iafrate is one of the most talented hockey player of the last century...C'mon you can't compare Gonchar and Niedermayer as all around talents.
huh? you totally missed my point - that or you chose to be ignorant

Neidermayer may have all around talents, doesn't mean he's more S K I L L E D then inferior players

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08-18-2004, 11:17 AM
  #21
in the hall
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Originally Posted by Chief
You might want to tell that to the boneheads who awarded him the Norris Trophy last season

It always cracked me up when Rangers fans would go on about how Brodeaur wasn't really that good a goalie. Now, I guess it's Niedermeyer's turn.
Ranger fans?

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08-18-2004, 11:44 AM
  #22
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There's more to playing defense than creating offense. I think most would agree that Niedermayer isn't as good as Lidstrom or Pronger, he just had a better 2003-04 season.

Scott Stevens certainly isn't putting up the points he used to, but he was certainly worth the 7 mil he earned in 2003. Niedermayer's contract is in the ballpark of what should be considered 'fair'. At this stage of his career, I think he's better than Zubov and Leetch who make ~6 mil.

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08-18-2004, 11:46 AM
  #23
jerseydevil
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Quote:
Originally Posted by in the hall
huh? you totally missed my point - that or you chose to be ignorant

Neidermayer may have all around talents, doesn't mean he's more S K I L L E D then inferior players
Yes..I chose to be Ignorant... ...your point just makes no sense to me...Your Niedermayer to Gonchar comparison holds no water..NONE..Niedermayer has better skating ability, stickhandling ability, plays better defense and makes far superior outlet passes...Gonchar has a better shot from the point and is a better PP Qb...

I stil don't understand how skill and talent are two different things...

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08-18-2004, 12:34 PM
  #24
gkrangers
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Put Gonchar on the Devils and his offensive numbers will drop.

He is allowed to play like a forward, thats why his point totals are so high.

Neidermayer is capable of putting up more points if he was in a system where he could roam free like Gonchar and Leetch were able too.

I'm not saying Neidermayer would score 100pts, but he would be among the point leaders for defensemen if he was allowed to play a full offensive defenseman role. His role is as a two way player, and he's really good at both ends of the ice, which makes him a great player at the moment.

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08-18-2004, 02:22 PM
  #25
Bob Froese
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gkrangers
He's worth more.
really? how do u figure that, to me he's lucky he got 7mill. he is nothing close to what lidstrom is and i would rather much have pronger or lidstrom than neidermeyer. ANYDAY. now that everyone says he is a 9 mkillion dollar a year player, take a look at those stats,he is just basically a 50 point a year player. not deserving more than 6 mill per, ok maybe he has leadership quality's but, thats not what he gets paid for . he gets paid to produce and looking at those #'s he is no where near a 9mill a season guy. far from it.
the only thing that is respectable or good about those stats are his over all plus/minus,which is excellent.

YEAR TEAM GP G A PTS PIM +/- PP SH GW GT SOG S/PCT
1991/92 New Jersey Devils 4 0 1 1 2 1 0 0 0 0 4 0.00
1993/94 New Jersey Devils 81 10 36 46 42 34 5 0 2 1 135 7.41
1994/95 New Jersey Devils 48 4 15 19 18 19 4 0 0 0 52 7.69
1995/96 New Jersey Devils 79 8 25 33 46 5 6 0 0 0 179 4.47
1996/97 New Jersey Devils 81 5 30 35 64 -4 3 0 3 0 159 3.14
1997/98 New Jersey Devils 81 14 43 57 27 5 11 0 1 0 175 8.00
1998/99 New Jersey Devils 72 11 35 46 26 16 1 1 3 0 161 6.83
1999/00 New Jersey Devils 71 7 31 38 48 19 1 0 0 0 109 6.42
2000/01 New Jersey Devils 57 6 29 35 22 14 1 0 5 0 87 6.90
2001/02 New Jersey Devils 76 11 22 33 30 12 2 0 6 0 129 8.50
2002/03 New Jersey Devils 81 11 28 39 62 23 3 0 3 0 164 6.71

NHL PLAYOFF STATS
YEAR TEAM GP G A PTS PIM +/- PP SH GW GT SOG S/PCT
1992/93 New Jersey Devils 5 0 3 3 2 -3 0 0 0 0 11 0.00
1993/94 New Jersey Devils 20 2 2 4 8 -1 1 0 0 0 29 6.90
1994/95 New Jersey Devils 20 4 7 11 10 11 2 0 1 0 53 7.55
1996/97 New Jersey Devils 10 2 4 6 6 0 2 0 1 0 34 5.88
1997/98 New Jersey Devils 6 0 2 2 4 0 0 0 0 0 15 0.00
1998/99 New Jersey Devils 7 1 3 4 18 -5 1 0 0 0 13 7.69
1999/00 New Jersey Devils 22 5 2 7 10 5 0 2 1 0 40 12.50
2000/01 New Jersey Devils 21 0 6 6 14 7 0 0 0 0 29 0.00
2001/02 New Jersey Devils 6 0 2 2 6 -1 0 0 0 0 6 0.00
2002/03 New Jersey Devils 5 1 2 3 8 1 0 0 0 0 8 12.50

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