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Winnipeg Jets - Free Agents, Trades, Rumors, Speculation-It all goes here; Part IV

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11-02-2011, 11:10 AM
  #251
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I think Buff being traded to a non hockey market makes the most sense. Those teams are trying to sell the "entertainment factor" to bring in fans. Buff in a traditional hockey market doesn't work because fans know there's more to hockey than entertainment.

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11-02-2011, 11:11 AM
  #252
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I think Buff being traded to a non hockey market makes the most sense. Those teams are trying to sell the "entertainment factor" to bring in fans. Buff in a traditional hockey market doesn't work because fans know there's more to hockey than entertainment.
I know what you're saying, but you worded this extremely poorly.

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11-02-2011, 11:14 AM
  #253
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I know what you're saying, but you worded this extremely poorly.
I just woke up, lol.

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11-02-2011, 11:15 AM
  #254
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GmOney, those are my thoughts on Omark as well. Some Oiler fans want to hype this guy up like he's a sure fire top 6'er. The fact is, he will be 25 in February, and has done nothing in the NHL. And he hasn't been able to make much of an impact on one of the worst teams in the league the last few years (obviously better this year).

If the Oilers were willing to take a 4th-6th round pick and/or a guy like Machacek (who I think should get another NHL chance), then maybe we could roll the dice and see if Omark can play on our 3rd line. Not that that should be hard with McKardle there.

The risk is that after reading the article, once Omark plays 4 more games, he needs to clear waivers if we decided he didn't fit. It would be a risk that if he didn't work out, we would have wasted whatever we used to trade for him.

Jet, could you see Omark on our 3rd line? Let's say Wheeler picks up his play and they keep Ladd/Little/Wheeler together, and Kane/Antro/Burmi together. Do you see Omark playing the 3rd line with Wellwood and Fehr? Does he fit there? I'll admit that while not a huge fan of his, he would HAVE to be better than McKardle (who I don't hate, it's just that he's not great).

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11-02-2011, 11:18 AM
  #255
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Going in a completely different direction here but what about Kieth Aulie from TOR, he seams to be the 8th D-man now that Gardiner has past him on the depth chart. He played very solid D when he was with the big club last year, especially when he was counted on to cover for Phaneuf's defensive lapses . I'm sure the leafs would move him as they already have Schenn and Komi that play similar games. Only problem is im not sure what the Leafs would want in return. I like the look of:
Toby - Buff
Bogo - Hainsey
Postma - Aulie
Kulda


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11-02-2011, 11:20 AM
  #256
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I wouldn't be interested in Omark at the cost of a 2nd rounder. This draft is too deep with talent to be giving up our high picks. Possibly a 3rd rounder this year or next, but nothing of any real value. Maybe a prospect like Machacek or Maxwell would work.

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11-02-2011, 11:26 AM
  #257
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I still don't understand why Buff isn't made to lay forward by our staff. I could careless about his hurt feelings or not wanting to play forward. He's making 5.2mil, he can go for a lot of therapy or stuff his face with food with that.

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11-02-2011, 11:31 AM
  #258
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Originally Posted by Paradise View Post
There's no way Boston considers Buff, his contract doesn't fit well with their future and he's know to be lazy, with a poor work ethic. Kaberle was eaten alive for the same type of laziness. julien would bench him or minimize his minutes, which doesn't work for them as contender. Boston would be interested in Kane and Bogosian. Chia was rumored to have interest in Bogo last year.

Kane
Bogo

for

Krejci
Hamilton

This is more doable from a Boston standpoint, even though Boston is very high on Hamilton. Swapping Little for Kane, or Buff for Bogo won't make this trade possible IMO.
I hear what you are saying, but I don't think that deal is good for us. Hamilton is a bright prospect, but so was Bogo. Maybe even more so that Hamilton is now. While Bogo has had some growing pains, he's looked very good lately. I also can't see any reason why we would trade Kane for Krejci. Besides Krejci's very good playoff run, his career would not indicate that he has anywhere near the value of Kane.

Boston fans have Krejci as their #3 centre after Bergeron and Seguin. Plus, they are looking ahead to next year when Krejci is going to get a raise and wondering how that is going to work.

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11-02-2011, 11:32 AM
  #259
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Originally Posted by Paradise View Post
I wouldn't be interested in Omark at the cost of a 2nd rounder. This draft is too deep with talent to be giving up our high picks. Possibly a 3rd rounder this year or next, but nothing of any real value. Maybe a prospect like Machacek or Maxwell would work.
Me neither. Maybe a 4th round and/or a guy like Machacek or Maxwell.

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11-02-2011, 11:36 AM
  #260
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GmOney, those are my thoughts on Omark as well. Some Oiler fans want to hype this guy up like he's a sure fire top 6'er. The fact is, he will be 25 in February, and has done nothing in the NHL. And he hasn't been able to make much of an impact on one of the worst teams in the league the last few years (obviously better this year).

If the Oilers were willing to take a 4th-6th round pick and/or a guy like Machacek (who I think should get another NHL chance), then maybe we could roll the dice and see if Omark can play on our 3rd line. Not that that should be hard with McKardle there.

The risk is that after reading the article, once Omark plays 4 more games, he needs to clear waivers if we decided he didn't fit. It would be a risk that if he didn't work out, we would have wasted whatever we used to trade for him.

Jet, could you see Omark on our 3rd line? Let's say Wheeler picks up his play and they keep Ladd/Little/Wheeler together, and Kane/Antro/Burmi together. Do you see Omark playing the 3rd line with Wellwood and Fehr? Does he fit there? I'll admit that while not a huge fan of his, he would HAVE to be better than McKardle (who I don't hate, it's just that he's not great).
My problem is, I don't see Ladd as a top 6 winger. Maybe he is going to prove me wrong (I hope he does). I see him as an EXCELLENT 3rd line guy. Gritty, shut down guy who can pot you 20-50 and who you want on the ice in the last minute.

I also don't see Fehr as a top 6 guy. I can imagine him being a bandaid for us going forward so I wouldn't rely on him anyway.

Wheeler? I have zero faith in this guy. He has had one real good spurt and that's it. He is lazy and just seems like someone that the Jets inherited and won't be in the long term plans. Again, I hope I am wrong about him.

Omark could lay a giant egg here. He could also realize his potential and become a nice top 6 winger here. That's what I am saying.

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11-02-2011, 11:49 AM
  #261
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I hear what you are saying, but I don't think that deal is good for us. Hamilton is a bright prospect, but so was Bogo. Maybe even more so that Hamilton is now. While Bogo has had some growing pains, he's looked very good lately. I also can't see any reason why we would trade Kane for Krejci. Besides Krejci's very good playoff run, his career would not indicate that he has anywhere near the value of Kane.

Boston fans have Krejci as their #3 centre after Bergeron and Seguin. Plus, they are looking ahead to next year when Krejci is going to get a raise and wondering how that is going to work.
I'm not saying the deal should be made either, but that's probably the value that would need to be considered for such a deal.

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11-02-2011, 11:55 AM
  #262
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My problem is, I don't see Ladd as a top 6 winger. Maybe he is going to prove me wrong (I hope he does). I see him as an EXCELLENT 3rd line guy. Gritty, shut down guy who can pot you 20-50 and who you want on the ice in the last minute.
I consider Ladd as more of a 2nd line forward not a 1st liner. The 20-50 statement is a 2nd liner on good NHL clubs. How many 3rd liners put up those type of numbers?

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11-02-2011, 12:14 PM
  #263
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I consider Ladd as more of a 2nd line forward not a 1st liner. The 20-50 statement is a 2nd liner on good NHL clubs. How many 3rd liners put up those type of numbers?
EXCELLENT ones

You are probably right and I hope Ladd thrives in the top 6 role. I have just never envisioned him as a top 6er.

As for Omark, I have a soft spot for him so perhaps that is biasing my comments somewhat, but sometimes guys like that surprise.

I keep thinking about Wellwood and where this team would be without him. There are other guys who have just needed a trade and a fair shake to blossom.

Either way, I'll let it go cause I feel like I'm the only guy who really thinks Omark is a player.

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11-02-2011, 12:34 PM
  #264
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EXCELLENT ones

You are probably right and I hope Ladd thrives in the top 6 role. I have just never envisioned him as a top 6er.

As for Omark, I have a soft spot for him so perhaps that is biasing my comments somewhat, but sometimes guys like that surprise.

I keep thinking about Wellwood and where this team would be without him. There are other guys who have just needed a trade and a fair shake to blossom.

Either way, I'll let it go cause I feel like I'm the only guy who really thinks Omark is a player.

I agree that sometimes a shakeup is necessary for some players. I also have no problem with Omark's skill level, I'm just against giving up anything of significance to find out.

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11-02-2011, 12:38 PM
  #265
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Originally Posted by Jet View Post
My problem is, I don't see Ladd as a top 6 winger. Maybe he is going to prove me wrong (I hope he does). I see him as an EXCELLENT 3rd line guy. Gritty, shut down guy who can pot you 20-50 and who you want on the ice in the last minute.

I also don't see Fehr as a top 6 guy. I can imagine him being a bandaid for us going forward so I wouldn't rely on him anyway.

Wheeler? I have zero faith in this guy. He has had one real good spurt and that's it. He is lazy and just seems like someone that the Jets inherited and won't be in the long term plans. Again, I hope I am wrong about him.

Omark could lay a giant egg here. He could also realize his potential and become a nice top 6 winger here. That's what I am saying.
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EXCELLENT ones

You are probably right and I hope Ladd thrives in the top 6 role. I have just never envisioned him as a top 6er.

As for Omark, I have a soft spot for him so perhaps that is biasing my comments somewhat, but sometimes guys like that surprise.

I keep thinking about Wellwood and where this team would be without him. There are other guys who have just needed a trade and a fair shake to blossom.

Either way, I'll let it go cause I feel like I'm the only guy who really thinks Omark is a player.
I agree with your analysis Jet. I don't see any of our wingers right now being true #1's. Kane may get there one day, but he's not there yet.

Ladd I see as a #2. Wheeler is an enigma. Most likely a #3 on great teams. Fehr is more likey an above average #3 as well IMO.

But I defiantly don't see Omark as a #1 winger. Don't see him as a #2 as well. That's why I was wondering what your thoughts were on his ability to be a #3. We could use him there.

If the price is cheap I would take a shot, but I would be worried about the fact that after 4 more games he is subject to waivers.

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11-02-2011, 12:46 PM
  #266
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I agree with your analysis Jet. I don't see any of our wingers right now being true #1's. Kane may get there one day, but he's not there yet.

Ladd I see as a #2. Wheeler is an enigma. Most likely a #3 on great teams. Fehr is more likey an above average #3 as well IMO.

But I defiantly don't see Omark as a #1 winger. Don't see him as a #2 as well. That's why I was wondering what your thoughts were on his ability to be a #3. We could use him there.

If the price is cheap I would take a shot, but I would be worried about the fact that after 4 more games he is subject to waivers.
I guess it depends on how the Jets want to design their lineup. Some teams have 2 scoring lines, a checking line (3rd) and a agitator line. Thats what we have. Some teams have 3 scoring lines, and a shutdown, agitating line. If that was the way we were going to go, then I could see Omark on the 3rd line. I just don't see him as a checking guy. I think a line of Fehr Slater Ladd could be a formidable 3rd line that could score, but also would play against the other team's top players. In that case I could see a line of more skill like Antro Burmi Omark, and then Kane Little Wheeler.

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11-02-2011, 12:55 PM
  #267
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I guess it depends on how the Jets want to design their lineup. Some teams have 2 scoring lines, a checking line (3rd) and a agitator line. Thats what we have. Some teams have 3 scoring lines, and a shutdown, agitating line. If that was the way we were going to go, then I could see Omark on the 3rd line. I just don't see him as a checking guy. I think a line of Fehr Slater Ladd could be a formidable 3rd line that could score, but also would play against the other team's top players. In that case I could see a line of more skill like Antro Burmi Omark, and then Kane Little Wheeler.
Ya, Omark is definitely not a checking/grinding type. He's more of a 2nd line forward, but even then I'm not sure he'll ever really be more than a shootout specialist IMO. That's the reason I wouldn't give up significant assets to find out. Too risky!

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11-02-2011, 01:14 PM
  #268
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I guess it depends on how the Jets want to design their lineup. Some teams have 2 scoring lines, a checking line (3rd) and a agitator line. Thats what we have. Some teams have 3 scoring lines, and a shutdown, agitating line. If that was the way we were going to go, then I could see Omark on the 3rd line. I just don't see him as a checking guy. I think a line of Fehr Slater Ladd could be a formidable 3rd line that could score, but also would play against the other team's top players. In that case I could see a line of more skill like Antro Burmi Omark, and then Kane Little Wheeler.
I think we only have a checking 3rd line because we HAVE to, not because they want to. We just don't have enough skilled players to fill out 3 lines. But, IF Omark could be a possible 3rd liner, we COULD roll 3 "scoring" lines with Omark/Wellwood/Fehr as the 3rd line.

When I think about it I don't even think we can say we have 2 scoring lines, 1 checking line, and an agitator line right now. Our 3rd is defiantly not a checking line if you've got guys like Wellwood or Wheeler on it.

I think we have two "scoring" lines (using the term scoring loosely), a 3rd line with no real identity (not a true checking line, but not staffed with skilled players either), and an energy, puck possession 4th line.

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11-02-2011, 01:17 PM
  #269
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I think we only have a checking 3rd line because we HAVE to, not because they want to. We just don't have enough skilled players to fill out 3 lines. But, IF Omark could be a possible 3rd liner, we COULD roll 3 "scoring" lines with Omark/Wellwood/Fehr as the 3rd line.

When I think about it I don't even think we can say we have 2 scoring lines, 1 checking line, and an agitator line right now. Our 3rd is defiantly not a checking line if you've got guys like Wellwood or Wheeler on it.

I think we have two "scoring" lines (using the term scoring loosely), a 3rd line with no real identity (not a true checking line, but not staffed with skilled players either), and an energy, puck possession 4th line.
In other words, we're hooped

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11-02-2011, 01:23 PM
  #270
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I think we only have a checking 3rd line because we HAVE to, not because they want to. We just don't have enough skilled players to fill out 3 lines. But, IF Omark could be a possible 3rd liner, we COULD roll 3 "scoring" lines with Omark/Wellwood/Fehr as the 3rd line.

When I think about it I don't even think we can say we have 2 scoring lines, 1 checking line, and an agitator line right now. Our 3rd is defiantly not a checking line if you've got guys like Wellwood or Wheeler on it.

I think we have two "scoring" lines (using the term scoring loosely), a 3rd line with no real identity (not a true checking line, but not staffed with skilled players either), and an energy, puck possession 4th line.
I brought this up before the season started. I was concerned about the talent level on the 3rd line (mostly wings), both defensively and offensively. I think the Jets want to be difficult to play against, and a balanced lineup definitely helps. We're still defining roles on this team, but I don't think we have what we truly need at our disposal right now.

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11-02-2011, 01:24 PM
  #271
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I don't know how in the world anyone can call a 29 goal scoring 59 point forward, a third liner.

Our lines are so jumbled it's not even funny. Enstrom, and Byfuglien to an extent were helping bring offense, but with Enstrom out, we could be in a heap of trouble.

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11-02-2011, 01:32 PM
  #272
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I don't know how in the world anyone can call a 29 goal scoring 59 point forward, a third liner.

Our lines are so jumbled it's not even funny. Enstrom, and Byfuglien to an extent were helping bring offense, but with Enstrom out, we could be in a heap of trouble.
It was one season, he must prove it was not the exception, but rather the rule. I know when Ladd was in Carolina and even Chicago, he was viewed as a likely 3rd line guy. He broke out in Atlanta last year, but he must prove he can maintain that level of play, in my opinion.

With that being said, I have little doubt he's a real solid second line guy. But, if we had a true star or two who could put up 70-80+, Ladd could be a good complimentary piece on the first line. All really depends how the team is made up depth/talent wise.

All in all, I think when we become healthy, our depth and line-up will hopefully take a better turn identity wise.

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11-02-2011, 01:57 PM
  #273
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It was one season, he must prove it was not the exception, but rather the rule. I know when Ladd was in Carolina and even Chicago, he was viewed as a likely 3rd line guy. He broke out in Atlanta last year, but he must prove he can maintain that level of play, in my opinion.

With that being said, I have little doubt he's a real solid second line guy. But, if we had a true star or two who could put up 70-80+, Ladd could be a good complimentary piece on the first line. All really depends how the team is made up depth/talent wise.

All in all, I think when we become healthy, our depth and line-up will hopefully take a better turn identity wise.
14:23 TOI in 08-09 with 49 points. Does that not count?

Ladd is ideally a 2nd line winger on a good playoff team.

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11-02-2011, 02:09 PM
  #274
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14:23 TOI in 08-09 with 49 points. Does that not count?

Ladd is ideally a 2nd line winger on a good playoff team.
Pretty much my thoughts regarding Ladd. Eventually Evander Kane will leapfrog him on the depth chart and become our first line LW. Question is just when that'll happen.

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11-02-2011, 02:23 PM
  #275
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14:23 TOI in 08-09 with 49 points. Does that not count?

Ladd is ideally a 2nd line winger on a good playoff team.
Did you want to mention his poor (in comparison) numbers the year after, being 09-10 season as well? 38 points in 82 games. He even had relatively the same average icetime that season too.

Does that not count?

If you'd like to disregard what i'm saying and look at the numbers, that's fine. Numbers don't exactly tell the story, in my opinion. I was a Canes fan for years and when we dealt Ladd to Chicago for Ruutu, it didn't appear that Ladd was going to grow into the point producing power forward we'd drafted 4th overall. Granted he was still young when we moved him, he had been given a few opportunities in the top 6 and just didn't show enough to stick there. In Chicago he blossomed some more, it was a better situation for him and great fit for the player he was and could still potentially be. Even still, many still projected him to be a very good 3rd line guy, but perhaps not offensively gifted enough for the top 6.

Numbers are numbers, I'm judging this by what I personally watched out of Ladd. Granted since then, he has taken some big steps forward. However, even still, he must prove last seasons numbers are the rule and not the exception.


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