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Your 2011-2012 St. Louis Blues part 2

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Old
12-01-2011, 12:47 AM
  #101
The Note
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Originally Posted by 2 Minute Minor View Post
Someone needs to tell Stewart he's playing for his next contract.
Maybe Oshie should, he sure looks like he is out there

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12-01-2011, 01:01 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by Celtic Note View Post
Instead of starting a new thread, I figured I might as well just post this here. If you think I should start a new thread, just say so.


With many of our players free agents at the end of the year, what do we try to do this season/trade deadline/offseason? How much does everyone get signed for this offseason?
Who do we target? How do we fill our holes?


RFAs (11-12 Salaries)

Stewart ($3.25M)
Oshie ($2.35M)
Perron ($2.5M)
Reaves ($.525M)

Total RFA Salaries=$8.625M


UFAs (11-12 Salaries)

Arnott ($2.5M)
Langenbrunner ($2.5M)
Nichol ($.6M)
Porter ($.6M)
Sterling ($.6M)

Jackman ($3.5M)
Colaiacovo ($2.5M)
Huskins ($1M)

Elliot ($.6M)

Total UFA Salaries =$14.3M
Total FA Salaries = $22.925M



Lineup without UFAs, using Blues Property

McDonald-Backes-Oshie
Perron-Berglund-Stewart
Steen-McRae-Tarasenko
Sobotka-Grachev-Reaves

Cole-Pietrangelo
Russell-Shattenkirk
Fairchild-Polak

Halak
Allen



Major holes I see:
#1 - Two-way, 1st-2nd Pairing LHD
#2 - 3rd Line Center
#3 - Backup G
#4 - Depth D
#5 - Depth Forwards
1) D'Agostini?

2) I want to see if Cole can keep up his current play for the rest of the year. If he can, we have the lefty D man we need and I'd just re-sign Jackman in the 3-3.5 mil range to round out the defense and find somebody like Huskins to be the #7 guy(Pie-Cole; Jackman-Shatty; Polak-Russell, FA #7, Ponich and Fairchild in Peoria for depth).

3) I fully expect Army to deal 2 of our forwards and some picks(Berglund and D'Agostini being my guess) for a Star center after the ownership issue gets settled. I think that's is as much to put the new owners "imprint" on the team as it is to just upgrade our skill level. I'm not going to speculate on who we'll be going after but I do think it will be a high-profile guy.


4) I'd be very interested in trying to get Elliott to stick around past this year. I think he and Halak are a very good tandem that could win us a Cup with the right team in front of them. I'm not sure if Elliott has the personality to accept being part of a tandem, but I'd definitely be putting some feelers out to be sure. I'd be willing to go up to the 1.8 mil that Craig Anderson got a few years ago to keep him around.

5) I'd give Oshie a contract in the 4 year, 4 mil range if he stays healthy all year.

Stewart and Perron should both get 1 year 3 mil deals. Let the guys prove they can score consistently and stay healthy before going long term with them.

Let Arnott and Lang's walk as UFA's. McRae and Tarasenko can fill their 3rd line roles. I think Backes, Steen, Jackman, McDonald and Pietrangelo bring enough leadership to let the vet's walk after the year.

Let Nichol and Porter walk as well. Crombeen will be healthy at some point and I can think of much worse 4th lines than Reaves/Grachev-Sobotka-Crombeen.

I'd try to keep Sterling and Cracknell around for depth in Peoria and I'd also make sure we have a viable center in Peoria in case of injuries(Hensick doesn't cut it and I don't think we can count on Lehtera to come over) and a veteran D man to replace Syvret.


Perron(3) - Star Center(7+) - Stewart(3)
Steen(3.363) - Backes(4.5) - Oshie(4)
McDonald(4.7) - McRae(.855) - Tarasenko(1)
Grachev(.817) - Sobotka(1.3) - Crombeen(1)
Reaves(.6) Porter(.7)

F Total- 35.835

Cole(1.3) - Pietrangelo(3.2)
Jackman(3.25) - Shattenkirk(1.3)
Polak(2.75) - Russell(1.3)
FA #7(1)

D Total-14.1 mil

Halak(3.75)
Elliott(1.8)

G Total- 5.55 mil

Team total- 58.485 mil

The payroll is still under 60 mil so it should be close to the budget that our new owners will be able to work with.

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Old
12-01-2011, 01:02 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by Celtic Note View Post
Major holes I see:
#1 - Two-way, 1st-2nd Pairing LHD
#2 - 3rd Line Center
#3 - Backup G
#4 - Depth D
#5 - Depth Forwards
A lot depends on who ends up buying the team, and what they set the payroll at. After we have that information, the real speculation can begin. For now, though:

#1
Right now Suter is the obvious FA fit...it would be hard to imagine a better one, even if you could hand-pick anyone you wanted. Assuming he hits the market, whatever spare dollars we have in the budget should be thrown at him. If he's re-signed, or out of our price range, then it's probably a roster hole that's not going to be filled unless there's a trade. Anyone that's a significant upgrade over what we have is going to cost a pretty penny.

#2
Could be almost anyone, as long as they display some offensive aptitude, a strong work ethic, and an aptitude for system play. I could see them re-signing Arnott if the rest of the year goes well and there's mutual interest. Chris Kelly from Boston could be a great fit, although the points he's putting up this season could push his street value a bit higher than it should be. A backup plan might be Sobotka. I don't think McRae's defense is currently at a level where the Blues would feel comfortable handing him the responsibility and ice-time that comes with the position. I could see him starting the season as the 4th line center, though.

#3
I think this one will be taken care of in-house. Either they'll re-sign Elliott or they'll go with Bishop.

#4
Sheesh. I guess it depends on how much money they dump into #1...if it's a lot, they'll probably roll with Cole and Russell rounding out the top 6 and invest in some low-cost depth to round out the crew. If they don't do much with #1, I could see them re-signing one of Jackman/Colaiacovo (both seems unlikely) and perhaps a bit higher quality depth option (think Huskins, but not necessarily him). They might augment the #8/9 slots as well, but nothing special (obviously).

#5
A lot of this will depend on what happens with Tarasenko and McRae. I think Tarasenko will snag the 3rd line RW slot, and Grachev will snag the 4th line LW slot if Sobotka ends up at center (the 13th forward slot if he doesn't). I'm guessing McRae ends up with the 4th line center slot, and Porter is signed as the 14th forward. If Tarasenko doesn't come over, things will get interesting (in a bad way).

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Old
12-01-2011, 11:38 AM
  #104
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Originally Posted by rumrokh View Post
You forgot D'Agostini and Crombeen, and chances are much better that Bishop moves into the backup spot before Allen graduates from the AHL.

But otherwise, you're right. The Blues will be hunting for a defenseman and a third line center. Unfortunately, the veteran third line centers available for the Blues via trade or signing are basically nonexistent. I like Sobotka and McRae, but I'd like to see them spring for a 2nd line centerman for that role and see the other guys compete.

The goaltending thing is open inasmuch as it could be Bishop, or even Allen, or a free agent, but I think it's likely they retain Elliott.
Yeah I totally forgot D'Agostini and Crombeen.

As for Bishop, he is a FA, so thats why I left him off.

Depending upon how the season goes, giving Elliot another round with the Blues would be a solid choice.

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12-01-2011, 03:04 PM
  #105
rumrokh
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Originally Posted by Celtic Note View Post
Yeah I totally forgot D'Agostini and Crombeen.

As for Bishop, he is a FA, so thats why I left him off.

Depending upon how the season goes, giving Elliot another round with the Blues would be a solid choice.
He's a restricted free agent and you have the rest of their RFA's signed. Not a big deal, just mentioning it in case you thought he was unrestricted.

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12-01-2011, 07:43 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by rumrokh View Post
He's a restricted free agent and you have the rest of their RFA's signed. Not a big deal, just mentioning it in case you thought he was unrestricted.
Thats a good point, I should have added him, but to me goaltending is bottom of the barrel in terms of needs. So, I just kind of haphazardly filled that part in. I should have been more on top of my game.

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12-02-2011, 05:48 PM
  #107
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Anybody want to take a stab at the lines for tomorrow night ?

Steen-Backes-Oshie
Perron-Berglund-Stewart
Dags-Arnott-Langenbrunner
Sobotka-Nichol-Reaves

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12-02-2011, 05:55 PM
  #108
rumrokh
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Originally Posted by Mike Liut View Post
Anybody want to take a stab at the lines for tomorrow night ?
Basically what you have.

Steen-Backes-Oshie
Perron-Berglund-Stewart
Sobotka-Arnott-Langenbrunner
Reaves-Nichol-D'Agostini

I could see D'Agostini and Langenbrunner getting rotated outright or depending on the score. I could also see Steen and D'Agostini taking shifts for Sobotka depending on how he's feeling. I think he slots in there ahead of D'Agostini just because Sobotka has looked pretty good on that line before.

I don't see a reason to sit Nichol, especially because his game has picked up significantly since the game in Minnesota, but I could see D'Agostini or Sobotka centering Reaves and Sterling. Who wants to face a team with that damn fourth line?

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12-02-2011, 05:55 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Liut View Post
Anybody want to take a stab at the lines for tomorrow night ?

Steen-Backes-Oshie
Perron-Berglund-Stewart
Dags-Arnott-Langenbrunner
Sobotka-Nichol-Reaves
No, I think D'Ags swings back to the right side and Langenbrunner goes to the 4th line. Sobotka is playing too well to get less ice time.

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12-02-2011, 05:58 PM
  #110
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Originally Posted by rumrokh View Post
Basically what you have.

Steen-Backes-Oshie
Perron-Berglund-Stewart
Sobotka-Arnott-Langenbrunner
Reaves-Nichol-D'Agostini

I could see D'Agostini and Langenbrunner getting rotated outright or depending on the score. I could also see Steen and D'Agostini taking shifts for Sobotka depending on how he's feeling. I think he slots in there ahead of D'Agostini just because Sobotka has looked pretty good on that line before.

I don't see a reason to sit Nichol, especially because his game has picked up significantly since the game in Minnesota, but I could see D'Agostini or Sobotka centering Reaves and Sterling. Who wants to face a team with that damn fourth line?


Where would Andy Mac fit in ? Assuming everybody is healthy, which doesn't happen very often. Damn, this team is deep.

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12-02-2011, 06:15 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by Mike Liut View Post
Where would Andy Mac fit in ? Assuming everybody is healthy, which doesn't happen very often. Damn, this team is deep.
McDonald-Backes-D'Agostini
Perron-Berglund-Stewart
Steen-Arnott-Oshie
Sobotka-Nichol-Langenbrunner

If they keep the top line together:

Steen-Backes-Oshie
Perron-Berglund-Stewart
McDonald-Arnott-Langenbrunner/D'Agostini
Sobotka-Nichol-D'Agostini/Langenbrunner

With Grachev, Crombeen, and Reaves in the mix, that's ridiculous. It's not an issue until McDonald returns and everyone else remains healthy, but that really smells like a trade.

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12-20-2011, 11:32 PM
  #112
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Can somebody answer when these players will be FA's ? TIA

Jackman
MacDonald
Carlo
Polak - only asking because I want him locked up long term

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Old
12-20-2011, 11:36 PM
  #113
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Can somebody answer when these players will be FA's ? TIA

Jackman
MacDonald
Carlo
Polak - only asking because I want him locked up long term
Jack and Carlo are UFAs after this season, McDonald after next, and Polak we signed to a 5 year extension before this season.

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12-20-2011, 11:52 PM
  #114
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Can somebody answer when these players will be FA's ? TIA

Jackman
MacDonald
Carlo
Polak - only asking because I want him locked up long term
http://capgeek.com/charts.php?Team=27

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12-21-2011, 06:08 AM
  #115
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Anyone think this could be the greatest 20-game stretch in Blues history?

Time for a little research ...

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12-21-2011, 09:36 AM
  #116
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Originally Posted by execwrite View Post
Anyone think this could be the greatest 20-game stretch in Blues history?

Time for a little research ...

Don't remember the year, but look at the President's Cup year. They probably had some good 20 game stretches. It seems they had 115 points that year.

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12-27-2011, 07:27 PM
  #117
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The Blues under Hitchcock:

Forwards:
PlayerGamesGoalsAssistsPointsHitchcock PacePayne Pace
Perron102810820
Backes22710176344
Oshie2187155951
Steen2268145257
Stewart1956114719
Berglund2256114132
Arnott2155103951
D'Agostini223583038
Sobotka142352932
Langenbrunner211672732
Grachev10123258
Porter15202110
Nichol2211276
Reaves1800000

Defensemen:
PlayerGamesGoalsAssistsPointsHitchcock PacePayne Pace
Colaiacovo140884729
Shattenkirk2147114144
Cole1113430N/A
Pietrangelo213252138
Russel2032521N/A
Polak220441525
Jackman220331113

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12-28-2011, 12:30 AM
  #118
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I like what he's done with Perron.

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12-28-2011, 01:38 AM
  #119
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I'm interested to see the ATOI difference between the two. Backes, Steen, and Oshie have seen TONS of ice time since Hitchcock took over while Payne was much more conservative and split time up more between the forward lines, based off what I've seen/remember, but I don't know what the numbers are exactly to really be able to judge.

It worries me a little bit to see some of our forwards getting 20-22 minutes regularly and Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk clocking in 23-25 minutes a night, but it's true there are plenty of players in the league who handle such loads, so why not get your best players on the ice?

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12-28-2011, 02:00 AM
  #120
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That's the beauty of youth. Those young bodies can handle minutes like that without breaking down.

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12-28-2011, 02:11 AM
  #121
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Originally Posted by oPlaiD View Post
I'm interested to see the ATOI difference between the two. Backes, Steen, and Oshie have seen TONS of ice time since Hitchcock took over while Payne was much more conservative and split time up more between the forward lines, based off what I've seen/remember, but I don't know what the numbers are exactly to really be able to judge.

It worries me a little bit to see some of our forwards getting 20-22 minutes regularly and Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk clocking in 23-25 minutes a night, but it's true there are plenty of players in the league who handle such loads, so why not get your best players on the ice?
23-25 minutes is not unusual fo a team's best 2 defencemen. 25 is routine. 23 is actually slightly low. 22 to 24 minutes is a little high for best forwards (at least 24 is).

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12-28-2011, 04:13 AM
  #122
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Originally Posted by oPlaiD View Post
I'm interested to see the ATOI difference between the two. Backes, Steen, and Oshie have seen TONS of ice time since Hitchcock took over while Payne was much more conservative and split time up more between the forward lines, based off what I've seen/remember, but I don't know what the numbers are exactly to really be able to judge.

It worries me a little bit to see some of our forwards getting 20-22 minutes regularly and Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk clocking in 23-25 minutes a night, but it's true there are plenty of players in the league who handle such loads, so why not get your best players on the ice?
There are a good number of players who routinely get that sort of ice time, but that usually involves a great deal of PP time or some "cheating" when it comes to playing the full length of the ice. Relatively few players have the ability to routinely pull down those sorts of numbers playing an up-tempo 200 foot game like the one Hitchcock is trying to play. One of the few clear advantages that the Blues have over most teams (when healthy) is their depth. It's one of the key reasons why they've had success against teams with greater "star power" but less depth. Our team routinely demonstrates the ability to aggressively take away time and space (while forechecking and backchecking), which mean that an opposing team has to truly earn their scoring chances against the Blues with hard work/skating. It's very hard to outwork/outskate a diligent team if you're taking extended shifts, or shifts without adequate rest in between. The physiology of the body's energy systems simply doesn't allow it. Many of the shallower teams that try usually end up "cheating" (with regards to their defensive responsibilities/play away from the puck) to compensate for their relative fatigue, or as an outright gambit where they intentionally leave the defensive zone early hoping that will eliminate the backside pressure (while hoping, of course, that the puck actually clears the defensive zone and makes it to them). Those are the types of teams that a Hitchcock style team and gameplan can absolutely dismantle...and we've seen it happen multiple times this season.

On the flip side, when the Blues have been forced to get a little top-heavy with their own ice times (due to injuries, or matchup problems on the road, or whatever), it usually leads to a bit sloppier defense/backchecking, or the team wearing noticeably down over the course of the game (especially if they haven't had a day or two off before the game in question). Ideally, our top forwards should routinely be in the 19-20 minute range (only rarely going higher), and the only defenseman getting more than 23 minutes a night should be Pietrangelo (and he should be under 25). Anything more than that on a routine basis is a bad sign for this team.

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Old
12-28-2011, 02:03 PM
  #123
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Flyers fan here, was wondering about Barret Jackman. Has there been any negotiations for a contract extension? If he were to hit the open market what would he command?

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12-28-2011, 02:47 PM
  #124
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Flyers fan here, was wondering about Barret Jackman. Has there been any negotiations for a contract extension? If he were to hit the open market what would he command?
Probably a repeat of his last contract, there's a chance the Blues let him walk and go after someone else. More likely they keep him because they don't need to invest in Colaiacovo if he's never going to be healthy enough to be a consistent part of the team and isn't exactly consistent when he actually is on the ice. Having Jackman as a veteran that's already a good fit would be the more pragmatic use of our UFA money than holding out for a complete upgrade and letting them both leave.

Whichever team makes Jackman an offer I'd expect 3 years in the mid $3Mil range as his play only seems to falter when he's injured and chooses to play through it. It's a shame he never developed some better puck skills or he'd be a much bigger part of the team at this point of his career.

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12-28-2011, 07:20 PM
  #125
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On the flip side, when the Blues have been forced to get a little top-heavy with their own ice times (due to injuries, or matchup problems on the road, or whatever), it usually leads to a bit sloppier defense/backchecking, or the team wearing noticeably down over the course of the game (especially if they haven't had a day or two off before the game in question). Ideally, our top forwards should routinely be in the 19-20 minute range (only rarely going higher), and the only defenseman getting more than 23 minutes a night should be Pietrangelo (and he should be under 25). Anything more than that on a routine basis is a bad sign for this team.
That's why I'm wondering about the actual numbers, because I check the ice time after most games and Pietrangelo and Shattenkirk hitting 25 min and Backes/Steen getting in the 21-23 range have been pretty regular.

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